Do you believe the world is overpopulated?

[Gomen]

I see a lot of people on different websites saying they want to come to America and go to college here. Maybe the jobs pay more here idk.

But if you're paying out of state money for college, the price is A LOT. Well it is in state too, but wayyy more out. People in America are going to college here and not being able to get a job afterwards.

There is close to 4M people being born in the U.S. each year. And then there are people who immigrate here.

I'm just wondering what this means for the future.

[David K]

If a person moves to America they have moved from somewhere. The population of the world isn't affected. And the population density of the USA is very low compared to a lot of other countries, such as the UK. You can let some more people move in.

The world itself is probably overpopulated at this point. People won't stop shagging, you see! But people in developed countries have fewer kids than people in poorer countries, for reasons I've completely forgotten and can't be bothered to look up.

As for jobs, that's a separate issue and not related to overpopulation at all. The more people live in a place, the more workers are needed. Think about it - the more people live there, the more people are needed to do things for those people. You need more shops, more doctors, more hospitals, more police, more schools, and so on. The number of jobs is directly proportional to the population.

[Merritt]

Proper sex education, better education in general, promotion of contraceptives, reasonable access to abortion, destigmatization of non-baby making sexual activity, loosening of religious morality... plenty can be done to slow down the process and make life better for the people who are already here.

I'm just hoping scientists will one day realise they can make infinite energy out of mushrooms or clouds or something and population won't be an issue. Come on, boffins, sort it out.

[David K]

^ We also need to figure out how to look after old people as fewer and fewer people have kids. I mean, it's obvious how: robots. But they have to be very kind robots!

[Unnecessarily Long Username_1]

I don't believe it's overpopulated, but wealth should be distributed more evenly.

[Coffee]

Originally Posted by David K

^ We also need to figure out how to look after old people as fewer and fewer people have kids. I mean, it's obvious how: robots. But they have to be very kind robots!

Yeah this is the big concern.

The States will be fine their demographics look sustainable, ours aren't great, somewhere like Italy is in a terrible position.

I think this is the key driver for why politicians have turned a blind eye and even encouraged mass immigration for the last 20 years, to replenish the stocks of younger tax payers to keep the state going in the near to medium future.

We'll all be long gone but it would be fascinating to be a fly on the wall in say 200 years time.

[SpaceMonkey]

Originally Posted by Coffee

Yeah this is the big concern.

The States will be fine their demographics look sustainable, ours aren't great, somewhere like Italy is in a terrible position.

I think this is the key driver for why politicians have turned a blind eye and even encouraged mass immigration for the last 20 years, to replenish the stocks of younger tax payers to keep the state going in the near to medium future.

We'll all be long gone but it would be fascinating to be a fly on the wall in say 200 years time.

I always laughed at this. Far Right supporters often claim there's a conspiracy by government/media to force-ably change the demographics of this country via immigration. As if Blair/Cameron et al woke up one morning and decided they wanted to turn the country Muslim (or something, it's hard to grasp what they actually believe is happening). The answer is very simple. We require immigration to keep the country afloat, both with highly skilled immigrants propping up the NHS or tech industries. Or low skilled immigrants keeping costs down, doing the jobs less desperate people would never touch with a barge pole. (generally Eastern Europeans/Africans here, Mexicans in the US).

I don't wanna bring the argument to Brexit again, but this fact isn't going to change just because we leave the EU. The idea that Brexit will lower immigration in any way is pretty absurd. We need people, we'll bring them in. Period. We've done it for 100+ years.

A bigger threat, than population growth, to the world is the rise of the middle classes in developing countries. India / China have always had big populations but most were extremely poor and didn't really use resources in the same way Americans/Western Europeans do. Now that China's economy is growing so fast, they are getting millions of new middle class families who love spending and consuming just as much as the rest of us.

In no way saying this is a bad thing, they have just as much a right as we do to enjoy life and improve their standards of living, but the world trying to keep up with that is going to have a far bigger strain on resources than actual population growth. India won't be far behind either.

Great for exporters though. There's a reason the government is pushing UK businesses to look to expand sales abroad so aggressively.

[Coffee]

Originally Posted by SpaceMonkey

I always laughed at this. Far Right supporters often claim there's a conspiracy by government/media to force-ably change the demographics of this country via immigration. As if Blair/Cameron et al woke up one morning and decided they wanted to turn the country Muslim (or something, it's hard to grasp what they actually believe is happening). The answer is very simple. We require immigration to keep the country afloat, both with highly skilled immigrants propping up the NHS or tech industries. Or low skilled immigrants keeping costs down, doing the jobs less desperate people would never touch with a barge pole. (generally Eastern Europeans/Africans here, Mexicans in the US).
.

I agree with you on the expansion of the middle class in the developing world, but thought I'd focus on the above bit first.

I think it depends how you look at it. To me the interesting side of your position is that people seem to be fine with solving one problem with another. It's a fact that people are reluctant to perform basic jobs. But rather than question that, think about what policies lead to that, and whether it should be fixed, we just pile on the easy option of more people to cover it up.

It's like fixing a person's malnutrition by standing them next to a fat person.

What happens when we can no longer immigrate ourself out of our financial problems? What happens when the bills comes due?

[Gomen]

Originally Posted by Fungus

I think America is approximately 10 times less densely populated than England but in world terms yes. There are about 75 million new people on the planet a year which is nearly the population of Germany and they all need resources and land so poverty will likely increase instead of going away. We are also entering the biggest mass extinction event since the dinosaurs caused entirely by man. This may collapse eco systems and cause famine at some point.The amount of fertile land needed to feed 7.5 billion people is also vast and climate change may make even less land available. Without change mass starvation on a monumental scale is inevitable at some point.

What do you mean by this?

[Ajax Amsterdam]

I know this adds nothing to the actual debate, but it's something that always strikes me.

The country, the world, does actually feel over-populated, but everytime I fly I'm glued to the window seat and looking down it actually looks like the world is not that populated at all. Even the UK seems to be a vast patchwork of fields rather than a mass of towns and cities. From up there, it doesn't look that populated at all.

I'm sure when we consider the amount of people and the amount of available resources the picture looks different, but as I said, this is just an observation that strikes me everytime I fly. Ignore me.

[Beep]

I think you only really need about six...

[SpaceMonkey]

Originally Posted by Coffee

I agree with you on the expansion of the middle class in the developing world, but thought I'd focus on the above bit first.

I think it depends how you look at it. To me the interesting side of your position is that people seem to be fine with solving one problem with another. It's a fact that people are reluctant to perform basic jobs. But rather than question that, think about what policies lead to that, and whether it should be fixed, we just pile on the easy option of more people to cover it up.

It's like fixing a person's malnutrition by standing them next to a fat person.

What happens when we can no longer immigrate ourself out of our financial problems? What happens when the bills comes due?

Politicians just work that way. Who wants to pass laws that won't benefit the country (and by extension, their career) until long after they have left office. It's part of the reason politicians are so reluctant to tackle climate change.

Robotics will solve a lot of the low skilled worker problems. As for high skilled immigration. They'll always be brainy people who we can basically steal from developing countries. You should check how many graduates China/India are pumping out each year, it's insane. US/Western Europe will welcome them with open arms. The 'brain drain' is a huge problem for developing countries. But do you really care enough to stop it? I doubt most people in the UK/US give a shit.

What makes you think they'll be a time we can't immigrate ourselves out of these issues?

[Dougella]

Originally Posted by Merritt

Proper sex education, better education in general, promotion of contraceptives, reasonable access to abortion, destigmatization of non-baby making sexual activity, loosening of religious morality... plenty can be done to slow down the process and make life better for the people who are already here.

I'm just hoping scientists will one day realise they can make infinite energy out of mushrooms or clouds or something and population won't be an issue. Come on, boffins, sort it out.

This.

[Between The Bars]

Am no going tae nae fukin America, av seen it aw on the telly, which we invented.

Scotland isnae overpopulated - yet.

[David K]

Originally Posted by Between The Bars

Am no going tae nae fukin America, av seen it aw on the telly, which we invented.

Scotland isnae overpopulated - yet.

Aye, Nicola says am welcome to come live with yous lot

[Between The Bars]

Originally Posted by David K

Aye, Nicola says am welcome to come live with yous lot

Yoo're alood DK, wance ye learn Gaelic.

[companioncube]

i wish it was a bit more quality than quantity, but it is what it is.

[Damp_Squib]

Originally Posted by Ajax Amsterdam

Even the UK seems to be a vast patchwork of fields rather than a mass of towns and cities. From up there, it doesn't look that populated at all.

And that's with the UK having a population equal to Canada, Australia and New Zealand combined!

[Omar Little]

It's already too late...

[six]

Originally Posted by Ajax Amsterdam

. Even the UK seems to be a vast patchwork of fields rather than a mass of towns and cities. From up there, it doesn't look that populated at all.

I'm sure when we consider the amount of people and the amount of available resources the picture looks different, but as I said, this is just an observation that strikes me everytime I fly. Ignore me.

Well... yes. It seems that some people believe that just because most of the land in the UK isn't built on means that the over-population thing is a myth, which certainly isn't the case. You said it yourself ... a patchwork of fields - intensively managed mono-culture serving primarily to support the human population, and increasingly eroding the few 'wild-ish' areas that remain.

I would argue that the UK is most certainly over-populated.

[Ajax Amsterdam]

Originally Posted by Damp_Squib

And that's with the UK having a population equal to Canada, Australia and New Zealand combined!

Wow, I didn't realise that. Amazing!

Originally Posted by Six

Well... yes. It seems that some people believe that just because most of the land in the UK isn't built on means that the over-population thing is a myth, which certainly isn't the case. You said it yourself ... a patchwork of fields - intensively managed mono-culture serving primarily to support the human population, and increasingly eroding the few 'wild-ish' areas that remain.

I would argue that the UK is most certainly over-populated

Oh, I don't doubt you there. How it looks isn't always how it is.

[Mr. Nobody]

It's not a question of belief it's a fact
Since I was born the population of the Earth has more than doubled
- that is one seriously scary fact,

as cc mentioned, it's also a question of quality not quantity,

I wish people would stop seeing that producing life is some great miracle that they HAVE to perform to carry on the family name/genes
it's not YOUR genes or name, they belong to humanity as a whole, we should be adopting and fostering more if we really feel we MUST have children,

I see it as as big a catastrophe as a possible world war 3

Earth's resources are Finite and stretched so we need to either consume a LOT less or stop runting a lot less

[Gomen]

Originally Posted by Carbon(cycle)Fodder

It's not a question of belief it's a fact
Since I was born the population of the Earth has more than doubled
- that is one seriously scary fact,

as cc mentioned, it's also a question of quality not quantity,

I wish people would stop seeing that producing life is some great miracle that they HAVE to perform to carry on the family name/genes
it's not YOUR genes or name, they belong to humanity as a whole, we should be adopting and fostering more if we really feel we MUST have children,

I see it as as big a catastrophe as a possible world war 3

Earth's resources are Finite and stretched so we need to either consume a LOT less or stop runting a lot less

I wouldn't mind if every country did as China and limited couples to only being able to have one child. I know not everybody would agree though.

[Jam]

Probably why I'm finding it hard to get a job

[kirbycrackle]

Yep. Think it's beyond argument. We we live waaay too long thanks to meds etc etc. We're not too far off the hunger games.

[Dougella]

Originally Posted by Gomen

I wouldn't mind if every country did as China and limited couples to only being able to have one child. I know not everybody would agree though.

It was enforced in an extremely brutal way though. Also a generation of only children does create problems. They've actually relaxed the policy now to allow people to have two children.

[Gomen]

Maybe they could just charge a large fine instead of brutality. Like $30000.

[Gomen]

Originally Posted by jam

Probably why I'm finding it hard to get a job

Yeah and it's going to get worse. Its so hard just getting even a retail/fast food job. They interview like 15 people at a time. I can't imagine what the world will look like 100-200 years from now.

Maybe all bachelor degrees will take 10 years to get instead of 4. It's stressful to think about. I'm glad I won't be born then.

[Dougella]

Originally Posted by Gomen

Maybe they could just charge a large fine instead of brutality. Like $30000.

That would still be rather brutal, if it means the parents then can't afford to feed/clothe their child

Personally I think better sex education, access to contraception and abortion when necessary is the way to go.

[flumpsy]

Mash up the octogenarians, put them in tins and hand them out to the poor. I get tired of saying this over and over but its clearly the best solution, why will people not listen. The poor can shut up and eat up, the old will stop complaining for fear of getting "selected for the next plateau" and pension payments will fall at a stroke.

We can then all attend our dinner parties drinking blue nun and chomping down fondue content that we have solved the great social care issue of our time !