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  #121  
Old 24th May 2018, 05:29
anxiouslondoner anxiouslondoner is offline
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Default Re: Does not having children (in your 30s plus) bother you?

I've seen the direction humanity is taking and I think it would be cruel and vindictive to bring a child into what looks to be a very dark future. Not that someone can't live a fulfilling and happy life, but probably only at the expense of someone else, taking from the rapidly shrinking pool of resources that humans need for an existence beyond desperate constant scrabbling for food and water. Besides my genes are not much of a guarantee of happiness anyway, I'm predisposed to a miserable outlook and it's plausible that my offspring would inherit that tendency.
Besides its a moot point as nobody wishes to have children with me. I can't manage a relationship never mind the shared responsibility of guiding a newborn to a state of adulthood I've never really achieved myself.
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  #122  
Old 24th May 2018, 10:02
limey123 limey123 is offline
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Default Re: Does not having children (in your 30s plus) bother you?

Nope, not in the slightest. I don't even have the money to fully support myself, let alone a dependant. Plus I find kids annoying, so that's two strikes. And I'm too self-centred to be a father - I like my peace and quiet too much.
Not to mention that in my view bringing a child into our future world could be considered almost an abuse. As someone else in the thread mentioned, we have 8 billion people on the planet and that number increases by 200,000 every day (from memory). We're already fighting for precious resources and wrecking our world; I don't want to be responsible for exposing some poor blighter to that ominous future. (With apologies to parents on this forum).
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  #123  
Old 24th May 2018, 17:50
Johnny88 Johnny88 is offline
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Default Re: Does not having children (in your 30s plus) bother you?

I'm actually glad I haven't got kids. I would struggle to cope.
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  #124  
Old 24th May 2018, 18:31
jinny jinny is offline
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Default Re: Does not having children (in your 30s plus) bother you?

as someone with children, I don't understand the viewpoint that choosing not to have children is a selfish act
You're all right in that there's just too many humans in the world already, it's far more selfish to go on reproducing knowing that.

I do worry about the world in the future, maybe not for my children, but then if they have children..what kind of place might they live in? What if we have things like drought or food shortages? Things we've never really had to deal with in this country?

I applaud your selflessness, & apologise for bringing more humans into the world (albeit really really good humans)
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  #125  
Old 24th May 2018, 18:40
Thousandmiles Thousandmiles is offline
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Default Re: Does not having children (in your 30s plus) bother you?

^ very interesting you said that, Jinny, about the world in the future, my best friend has chosen not to have children, for those kind of reasons, that are somehow global, not personal...she always talks about wars and pollution and overpopulation and crime and all that and I just tell her she's mad
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  #126  
Old 24th May 2018, 19:03
jinny jinny is offline
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Default Re: Does not having children (in your 30s plus) bother you?

I don't think she's mad...it's not that long ago Europe lived through a horrific war, there are still terrible wars going on all over the world, we have grown up in peace time in a democratic country, but what if society became terrible? like it is in lots of places?

sometimes I watch my kids rolling out their basic outdoor skills that they've learned in cubs, like fire building, & think...ok..it might not be Bear Grills but they've got an advantage over the kid next door who only ever plays on the X-Box....if the world does turns to s***
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  #127  
Old 24th May 2018, 19:15
Thousandmiles Thousandmiles is offline
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Default Re: Does not having children (in your 30s plus) bother you?

Well, her dad works as a doctor in Syria and has done for many years, so it is more real to her than me, and she worries about financial aspect too. I just think I must be a selfish person, because if I was gonna have a child the last thing on my mind would be the world or society. I see it as a miracle. And hear you all laugh, it's ok, I don't mind
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  #128  
Old 24th May 2018, 19:48
Dougella Dougella is offline
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Default Re: Does not having children (in your 30s plus) bother you?

^ Oh I agree it is a miracle to create a totally new human being and I understand why some people want to do it,it's just not for me

Someone in a video I was watching today described having to drag her two wailing children out of a park because they'd been warned that if they threw sand they would have to go home, and they still threw the sand. I'm not sure people think of those moments when they're deciding to have a baby.
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  #129  
Old 24th May 2018, 20:15
Thousandmiles Thousandmiles is offline
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Default Re: Does not having children (in your 30s plus) bother you?

^ I know bringing them up is not a walk in the park and you loose yourself a lot at that time, but on another note I'd like to know why do people who have mental issues like anxiety, do not believe they could be good parents because of their issues? With the knowledge and awareness and insight into so much psychology and wellbeing, wouldn't that be a good base? Or most people are seriously concerned to pass on the bad genes?
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  #130  
Old 24th May 2018, 20:53
Johnny88 Johnny88 is offline
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Default Re: Does not having children (in your 30s plus) bother you?

The future is not necessarily all bleak. Change comes from anticipating catastrophes. I suspect future generations might very well live better quality lives. Also it is future generations that will be part of a momentum for change. Reproducing ain't that bad just people like me aren't capable of being a reliable parent.


There are definitely a lot of reasons to be positive about the future.
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  #131  
Old 24th May 2018, 20:55
Johnny88 Johnny88 is offline
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Default Re: Does not having children (in your 30s plus) bother you?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dougella
^ Oh I agree it is a miracle to create a totally new human being and I understand why some people want to do it,it's just not for me

Someone in a video I was watching today described having to drag her two wailing children out of a park because they'd been warned that if they threw sand they would have to go home, and they still threw the sand. I'm not sure people think of those moments when they're deciding to have a baby.
Have you heard Bill Hicks talk about the miracle of childbirth?
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  #132  
Old 24th May 2018, 21:53
jinny jinny is offline
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Default Re: Does not having children (in your 30s plus) bother you?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thousandmiles
^ I know bringing them up is not a walk in the park and you loose yourself a lot at that time, but on another note I'd like to know why do people who have mental issues like anxiety, do not believe they could be good parents because of their issues? With the knowledge and awareness and insight into so much psychology and wellbeing, wouldn't that be a good base? Or most people are seriously concerned to pass on the bad genes?
that's a really good point. I'm not sure whether my anxiety is genetic, but I certainly have a lot of very serious issues over and above the anxiety because of the way I was raised and the neglect & emotional/psychological abuse I had as a child.

I think having children a bit later (30s) when I'd started to understand my own childhood, having an insight into anxiety and mental health & how important childhood is with regards to having mental health issues later in life & then studying early years education has made me a good mum. I'm not selfish or just expect my children to turn out ok with no input. If you want to raise happy people you have to parent them...not just feed & cloth them. So yep...I think it can be a really good base to be a good parent.
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  #133  
Old 24th May 2018, 23:18
jinny jinny is offline
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Default Re: Does not having children (in your 30s plus) bother you?

aw, I was enjoying Johnny's positivity

maybe he's right? Maybe in the future we'll all be beamed back up to the mother planet and live a blessed and wonderful life.
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  #134  
Old 25th May 2018, 01:56
Freyja Freyja is offline
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Default Re: Does not having children (in your 30s plus) bother you?

Quote:
Originally Posted by HermannHesse
No there isn't. What a ridiculous thing to say.
Sorry I'm in agreement with HermannHesse here. Let me bring you into reality.

Kids are a bad idea with the way things are. The planet is dying from pollution, everything is getting expensive, there's a massive homeless people problem in THIS country, a first world country keep in mind. You have people sleeping on the streets as young as 18 now too. People are literally using food banks from charities because our country is that ridiculous.

We have a massive out of control drugs problem in this country, housing takes months to get anywhere and not to mention the ridiculously huge paedophile problem.

There are so many dangers in having kids and it takes the slightest thing to **** up all your hard work you've put into that life you've created.

You can do all that, pay for private schooling even, then all they have to do is end up liking their drink too much and end up still at yours at 30 years old with a drinking problem.

I didn't get my tubes clipped cause I'm insane, it makes actual ****ing sense in this day and age where everything has gone to absolute shit. You'd be lucky if you end up in a well paying job these days because the competition is ridiculous. If I was a parent I'd be absolutely shitting bricks. No offence to parents on here, though I wish you the best of luck.

It's fine to be positive, but don't pretend like the future isn't bleak because it obviously is, anyone can see that from reading a newspaper or looking at the state of government.

Things usually get far worse before they get better as well because change doesn't happen miraculously out of thin air, it devolves out strife and death and I'd rather not put a life I've created through that suffering.

Being child free for the environment isn't a selfish thing so I agree with Jinny on that one, people are just dicks and think it is selfish when it's not. Pro lifers are probably to blame with all their bickering nonsense. I just find it ridiculous.

There's so many more things, I could go on and on for days but if I did that it'd be like reading out the China study and ain't nobody got time for that.

I'm not intending to offend anyone here by the way, I'm genuinely just that much of an anti-natalist and hold some very strong views towards it. I suppose it's good to be passionate about something.
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  #135  
Old 25th May 2018, 09:05
Thousandmiles Thousandmiles is offline
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Default Re: Does not having children (in your 30s plus) bother you?

Interesting subject, and I'm enjoying this conversation. Just for the record, I thoroughly respect everyones choices in life, if anything, I envy people who know what they want. All very valid reasons and arguments.

^ I totally hear you Freyja, you talk exactly like my friend, makes me understand her better tbh. There is not one thing I wouldn't agree with you on the whole, but it's not how I feel.

I do idolise many things, I suppose, and most answers are about "me" and "I" as if you would have to do everything on your own, alone. But it's meant to be a joint task, you know, you pick up where your partner can't deliver and vice versa, and there is that other person to lean on when you need to.

^^ HermannHesse, if there was a prize for writing on here, I'd give it to you!
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  #136  
Old 25th May 2018, 13:37
Johnny88 Johnny88 is offline
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Default Re: Does not having children (in your 30s plus) bother you?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Freyja
Sorry I'm in agreement with HermannHesse here. Let me bring you into reality.

Kids are a bad idea with the way things are. The planet is dying from pollution, everything is getting expensive, there's a massive homeless people problem in THIS country, a first world country keep in mind. You have people sleeping on the streets as young as 18 now too. People are literally using food banks from charities because our country is that ridiculous.

We have a massive out of control drugs problem in this country, housing takes months to get anywhere and not to mention the ridiculously huge paedophile problem.

There are so many dangers in having kids and it takes the slightest thing to **** up all your hard work you've put into that life you've created.

You can do all that, pay for private schooling even, then all they have to do is end up liking their drink too much and end up still at yours at 30 years old with a drinking problem.

I didn't get my tubes clipped cause I'm insane, it makes actual ****ing sense in this day and age where everything has gone to absolute shit. You'd be lucky if you end up in a well paying job these days because the competition is ridiculous. If I was a parent I'd be absolutely shitting bricks. No offence to parents on here, though I wish you the best of luck.

It's fine to be positive, but don't pretend like the future isn't bleak because it obviously is, anyone can see that from reading a newspaper or looking at the state of government.

Things usually get far worse before they get better as well because change doesn't happen miraculously out of thin air, it devolves out strife and death and I'd rather not put a life I've created through that suffering.

Being child free for the environment isn't a selfish thing so I agree with Jinny on that one, people are just dicks and think it is selfish when it's not. Pro lifers are probably to blame with all their bickering nonsense. I just find it ridiculous.

There's so many more things, I could go on and on for days but if I did that it'd be like reading out the China study and ain't nobody got time for that.

I'm not intending to offend anyone here by the way, I'm genuinely just that much of an anti-natalist and hold some very strong views towards it. I suppose it's good to be passionate about something.

problems do not equate to hopelessness. tell me where there isn't problems?

and I disagree with Hesse, it is not a ridiculous thing to say (well not necessarily). it would be ridiculous to suggest that there is definitely only a future which is full of doom.
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  #137  
Old 25th May 2018, 16:19
jinny jinny is offline
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Default Re: Does not having children (in your 30s plus) bother you?

Quite right Johnny

Its hard to be positive when their is so much we know is wrong in the world, but the world we live in is the one we have and not a single individual can be responsible for solving all its problems... So likewise as individuals we shouldn't carry the whole weight of the world on our shoulders , do the small things that make your own bit of the world a better place.
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  #138  
Old 25th May 2018, 16:32
Johnny88 Johnny88 is offline
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Default Re: Does not having children (in your 30s plus) bother you?

If you can positively state that the problems we face today are insurmountable then yes it wouldn't paint a nice picture but that is certainly not the case.
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  #139  
Old 25th May 2018, 16:51
Vienna Vienna is offline
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Default Re: Does not having children (in your 30s plus) bother you?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny88
Have you heard Bill Hicks talk about the miracle of childbirth?
That sounds like something I'd like to listen to lol
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  #140  
Old 25th May 2018, 21:01
Dougella Dougella is offline
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Default Re: Does not having children (in your 30s plus) bother you?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny88
Have you heard Bill Hicks talk about the miracle of childbirth?
I haven't but I get the feeling I should

I do think that actual childbirth is a cruel trick nature plays on us, it does not sound like a beautiful miracle lol.
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  #141  
Old 25th May 2018, 21:34
jinny jinny is offline
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Default Re: Does not having children (in your 30s plus) bother you?

I don't think of it as a beautiful miracle, it really is just biology and physics gone wrong. It doesn't fit. And that really really really really really really hurts. Lots.
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  #142  
Old 25th May 2018, 23:02
michelle06 michelle06 is offline
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Default Re: Does not having children (in your 30s plus) bother you?

I wish I could be as passionately anti-children as some of you, as it would make it easier. I think it's worse when you're not 100% sure either way. I always thought I didn't want kids and, on the whole, I can't see me having kids, but I'm 34 and fertility declines rapidly after 35, apparently, so it's on my mind, because what if I regret not having a family?

Ultimately, I don't like the thought of carrying a child, though, and I think I'd be okay with the baby phase (apart from sleep deprivation), but it's what they turn into that puts me off. Once they start having their own opinions and questioning me, I don't know how I'd cope. I was a horrible teenager (aren't most teenagers?!) Plus, maybe it would be cruel to inflict myself on a sprog.

Mind you, I'm single and live at home with no prospect of that changing any time soon, so it's pointless thinking about it really!
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  #143  
Old 26th May 2018, 01:11
Freyja Freyja is offline
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Default Re: Does not having children (in your 30s plus) bother you?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny88
problems do not equate to hopelessness. tell me where there isn't problems?

and I disagree with Hesse, it is not a ridiculous thing to say (well not necessarily). it would be ridiculous to suggest that there is definitely only a future which is full of doom.
I think we're pretty f*cked as a species actually, I see sod all hope for us and I don't want to be bringing a kid into that mess. Plenty of famous intellectual people have often called humanity a plague on the earth and I very much agree.

Keep in mind you're having a discussion with an antinatalist in the mix here, I think birth/existence is suffering in itself so there's not really a debate to be had but I enjoy your point of view.


For those here wanting children but don't want to go through with birth - you do realise there's a foster care crisis in the UK right? There's plenty of good kids out there that need homes. Plus side you won't have to deal with a screaming baby if you didn't want to.

This article is from last year in October and I can't imagine the care system is much different. I feel pretty sorry for the kids in care homes, those places are horrible.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-a7995101.html
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  #144  
Old 26th May 2018, 09:13
Toxic Toxic is offline
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Default Re: Does not having children (in your 30s plus) bother you?

I got into a right debate at work yesterday, someone was ranting about their kid being a pain, she turned to me..god don't ever have kids!

To which I respond, don't worry I won't..never ever, not a chance

"What? Your never having kids?!, how can you do that, I couldn't imagine my life without having my children!" ..and on it went for 15 minutes.

Like, christ on a bike..I felt like I was getting a bollocking at school, and I'm male..if I was female I can only imagine the ranting I would have received, I have to sympathize with you women not wanting kids, you must get a right earful from certain people
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  #145  
Old 26th May 2018, 10:50
Dougella Dougella is offline
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Default Re: Does not having children (in your 30s plus) bother you?

^ It's odd how people confuse the idea of them not being able to imagine their life without their children (which you'd hope they couldn't because otherwise they'd be wishing their children hadn't been born and that would be a major problem!) with the idea that everyone should have kids, when actually some of us are quite happy as we are.
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  #146  
Old 26th May 2018, 12:07
jd90 jd90 is offline
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Default Re: Does not having children (in your 30s plus) bother you?

I don't like the idea of having kids at all. But every so often I do think, later on in life, about adopting. Might just be my weakness for wanting to rescue things, but yeah a pair of siblings that had never had any love, to give them a home would be pretty nice. I wouldn't be increasing the amount of people on this planet but i'd be saving and helping some kids that need it. As long as they were over 5/6! But then I think ''nah god help me no way''
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  #147  
Old 28th May 2018, 17:20
Johnny88 Johnny88 is offline
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Default Re: Does not having children (in your 30s plus) bother you?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Freyja
I think we're pretty f*cked as a species actually, I see sod all hope for us and I don't want to be bringing a kid into that mess. Plenty of famous intellectual people have often called humanity a plague on the earth and I very much agree.

Keep in mind you're having a discussion with an antinatalist in the mix here, I think birth/existence is suffering in itself so there's not really a debate to be had but I enjoy your point of view.


For those here wanting children but don't want to go through with birth - you do realise there's a foster care crisis in the UK right? There's plenty of good kids out there that need homes. Plus side you won't have to deal with a screaming baby if you didn't want to.

This article is from last year in October and I can't imagine the care system is much different. I feel pretty sorry for the kids in care homes, those places are horrible.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-a7995101.html

fair do's
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  #148  
Old 28th May 2018, 17:31
Johnny88 Johnny88 is offline
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Default Re: Does not having children (in your 30s plus) bother you?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vienna
That sounds like something I'd like to listen to lol
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dougella
I haven't but I get the feeling I should

I do think that actual childbirth is a cruel trick nature plays on us, it does not sound like a beautiful miracle lol.
I will try to find a clip of it on youtube

to be fair I do think it both a miracle and sort of run-of-the-mill also. Like, I do imagine if I ever did become a father, I would be freaking out at the absurdity of bringing this little life into being. it definitely wouldn't seem so normal if it was me becoming a father lol
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  #149  
Old 28th May 2018, 17:34
Johnny88 Johnny88 is offline
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Default Re: Does not having children (in your 30s plus) bother you?



I came across this but it wasn't the one I was looking for. pretty funny still.

you gotta love his swagger.
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  #150  
Old 28th May 2018, 17:56
Johnny88 Johnny88 is offline
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