Married or in a relationship? You don't have SA

[Chris P]

This is not a rant, neither am I having a dig at people, so here goes...

I honestly can't get my head around the idea that people who post on here who claim to have SA are actually in relationships or married. I really don't understand how exactly you can say you have SA being in this position. Put simply, if you can approach women, the world is you oyster, so to speak.

To me people with SA are more likely to be single and never had a girlfriend or boyfriend in their lives, like me.

Are there any guys on here married? If so, do you really have SA? In my experience, shyness is the route cause of my SA. So obviously being married you must of overcome this problem somehow?

SA - shyness = SA free

[Munkeh]

I think there's a massive misconception with a number of people on this site. Just because it's something that you strive for and struggle with, doesn't mean it's the be all and end all for everyone and the cure for people's anxieties.

People in relationships can have just as many problems as people who aren't in them. Maybe they're not the same problems, but it doesn't make them any less damaging. There's different levels of shyness, and just because you have a partner doesn't mean you don't struggle around strangers and in social situations.

I've seen numerous posts by people questioning how someone can have social anxiety even though they obviously have friends and aren't stuck inside all the time. Like everyone on here is supposed to be in the same situation and incredibly miserable with it.

[GhostOnMagneticTape]

Chris

People have varied levels of social anxiety for different reasons, your social anxiety is different to others, we all find different things difficult in every day situations.

I fail to understand how you think because someone has a mental health problem they are unable to have a relationship (or the fact is you seem to be questioning that) which may offend some people here. It's like you're saying all people with SA should be like you unless I am getting the wrong end of the stick? There is no standard on what SA is and what people are able to do or not.

Seems like another SAUK myth, that all people with SA are not in relationships as well as being ugly with no job as Emissary pointed out.

[Ice203]

Hi. im married and yes i do have sa, tho i didnt have sa when i meet my wife, and even now i dont have any trouble meeting girls, Sa affects people in different ways, if you have it really bad then maybe you will have trouble having a relationship,

And just cos u can approach women doesnt mean you dont have sa,
On my good days im happy to approach and talk to anyone, but the next day i might be the oppisite and not be able to even leave the house,

[handmedown]

Like others have said, SA affects people in different ways. I have a boyfriend but I really struggle with making friends more than with forming romantic relationships.

[Chris P]

Originally Posted by Emissary

It's also true that you don't have SA if you have a job, and you don't have SA if you're good looking.

Definitely a facepalm moment there on my part I'm in a job (for now anyway, redundant this month) so yeah, I appear to have kicked myself in the teeth with my OP.

[Winnie57]

As people above have said, SA doesn't rule out having a partner. Some people may have been very lucky in the way they found their partner. Don't assume it's been easy.

Personally my partners in my youth were probably not right for me as a result of my SA. I am more careful now.

[Dandelion10]

I don't get it either but thats seperate from my general dislike of couples.

The couple in question though may have thought the same and their current relationship is an experiment to test that theory.

But everything we understand relationships to be: fulfilling, emotionally healing, mentally restorative, validating, confidence boosting-none of those things relate to how we understand SA.

We understand SA as a stubborn mule that won't allow any of those pleasant feelings. It ignores attraction, confounds romantic advances and denies itself intimacy so like maths we assume if that not the formula then the person must not have SA.

The fact is people are more complex than that and full of contradictions, there's different degrees of SA some can live together, some have long-distance relationships and some don't ever dare.

[Chimpy]

Originally Posted by Chris P

Are there any guys on here married? If so, do you really have SA?

SA can be very context sensitive. I am married (to an SA partner, Anonymous Laura, who I met through this board) and have no SA whatsoever about being with her, but suffer from pretty bad SA with respect to friends and work (to a lesser extent with family too). I cannot sit in an open plan in work, have real difficulty visiting public places like pubs, I have lost contact with almost all my non-SA friends, I have been through various mental health services, am in counselling and take a number of drugs to try to control my condition and am registered as disabled with my HR department at work.

I think it is healthier in the long run not to make these sort of "my SA is worse than your SA" comparisons. We all suffer in different ways.

EDIT: I should have noticed my wife typing away at the same time as me...

[Medea]

Originally Posted by Chris P

This is not a rant, neither am I having a dig at people, so here goes...

I honestly can't get my head around the idea that people who post on here who claim to have SA are actually in relationships or married. I really don't understand how exactly you can say you have SA being in this position. Put simply, if you can approach women, the world is you oyster, so to speak.

To me people with SA are more likely to be single and never had a girlfriend or boyfriend in their lives, like me.

Are there any guys on here married? If so, do you really have SA? In my experience, shyness is the route cause of my SA. So obviously being married you must of overcome this problem somehow?

SA - shyness = SA free

Well some of us SAers are women and not lesbians, so we don't go looking for other women...

I'm married and I met my husband through SAUK, but that's beside the point. SA is not about not being able to get married, it's a fear of social situations, not a fear of having a boyfriend/girlfriend, though it can certainly have a huge effect on that (I had never had a relationship until I met fellow SAers).

I often think the same about people having jobs. How can you have a job and have SA? But then I realise that that is not what SA is but it is something my SA effects to the point where I can't work.

Please people, stop pointing fingers and saying "you don't have SA because you can do x and I can't and I KNOW I have SA!".

[W!llow]

I have explained how I managed to get married before and to be honest I really can't be bothered to say much because for some what I've said obviously goes either unheard or in one ear and out the other but I will say a bit. Some peoples SA seems purely about forming relationships with potential partners but SA affects so much more than that, but if I was to form a new relationship now, I would find it extremely hard in many ways. When I was younger I had been ill, I ended up with bad SA I could barely see anyone, family or friends, I used to have anxiety attacks if there was a knock at the door. (still can be a bit like that during bad times). I however had when well been to a wedding met my now husband and we were penfriends for a few years, he knew from my letters what I was like, at that time I didn't socialise I couldn't cope with it (I did go to some religious meetings because I believed they were not optional but at that time I always sat on the end of a row at the back and still would have an anxiety attack and often sit waiting in the car for my parents, I would generally go in late and leave early to try to avoid people talking to me and me panicking). Anyway when we started going out he would come over and we would usually go for long walks, but I was still frequently having anxiety attacks. I had a panic attack on my wedding day with only both sets of parents and a couple of witnesses there. I did and have improved a lot since then but I totally disagree with the judgement that you can't have SA if you are married or in a relationship. You don't have to be like I was to have a problem, people maybe drink heavily to socialise and end up meeting someone in that way for instance, just because they have managed it doesn't mean they haven't got a problem, they have just used alcohol as a mask to help them cope. Also some people may be perfectly o.k in that area but not in others.
I've always been a fighter anyway. ( I don't think people would necessarily see that about me and there are times I want out but when I think back to how I used to suffer socially the amount of times I had really bad anxiety attacks and the fact I would keep trying, I may have got very upset along the way but I tended to go back and persist.)

[RattyLady]

Well I have SA which has prevented me from working for several years, and my partner of nearly seven years has schizophrenia. As Winnie57 said it was lucky we found one another and clicked as we did, if we hadn't I presume I'd have been single all this time as the concept of 'dating' and actually looking for a partner terrifies me

[ratty]

It's like saying "You can leave the house? You don't have SA" or 'You go to work? You don't have SA". What about people who have friends, do they not have SA either?

It's a sliding scale, everyone experiences things differently and everyone has different struggles and things they find impossible. I find it really weird that people don't seem to understand this.

[GhostOnMagneticTape]

Originally Posted by ratty

It's a sliding scale, everyone experiences things differently and everyone has different struggles and things they find impossible. I find it really weird that people don't seem to understand this.

I second that, it's frustrating some SA sufferers have this perception that we are all alike in terms of the way we are and what we are not able to do, as though we are robotic clones or something living exactly the same lives!

[T]

I get really paranoid when threads like this appear here... even though i don't have a partner... SA comes in many forms and affects us each differently...take for me i work.. also loves to go to gigs/festivals, rollerblade.. go out to pubs and such... i post pics and vids here... people may think on here that i don't have SA because i do all them things... far from it... its taken me years to get to that stage... put in alot of hard work... i don't think my SA will ever leave... for one using a phone is a real stumbling block for me also talking with authority figures thats a real stumbling block too..i don't begrudge people who are in relationships one bit and good luck to them i say....like i say SA effects us in different ways so please don't think people don't have SA coz there in relationships/have a social life.... a few times now i've nearly stopped posting here coz i don't think people think i have SA...

well thats my two cents worth..

[black_mamba]

I find this thread very offensive.

What benefit does anyone get out of the accusation that someone is feigning their social anxiety?

It's bullshit. If there was something to be gained from questioning other people's conditions, then I wouldn't be speaking so harshly, but otherwise I think accusatory questions like this serve no purpose and are purely harmful to others.

I do understand the question though. I don't deny that I find it odd how attractive people can have BBD or how chatty people can have SA (seemingly contradictory situations)...but we need to respect each other's mental health issues and approach issues with an open mind, and not with your mind already made up i.e. 'You don't have SA'

[Asymmetric Being]

It's a good point you make there T about working hard to get to where you are, afterall that is what the site is all about isn't it? At least that what I think anyway, so it makes sense that we are all at varying stages of sa.

[T]

Originally Posted by black_mamba

I find this thread very offensive.

What benefit does anyone get out of the accusation that someone is feigning their social anxiety?

It's bullshit. If there was something to be gained from questioning other people's conditions, then I wouldn't be speaking so harshly, but otherwise I think accusatory questions like this serve no purpose and are purely harmful to others.

I do understand the question though. I don't deny that I find it odd how attractive people can have BBD or how chatty people can have SA (seemingly contradictory situations)...but we need to respect each other's mental health issues and approach issues with an open mind, and not with your mind already made up i.e. 'You don't have SA'

Originally Posted by Sabzz

It's a good point you make there T about working hard to get to where you are, afterall that is what the site is all about isn't it? At least that what I think anyway, so it makes sense that we are all at varying stages of sa.

gotta agree with these points...

[luke]

i can understand if ppl are married and in relationships im sure they worked hard to get there but i cant understand how sum ppl with sa can go out on the pull and have lots of flings and one night stands, surely meeting new ppl is the most daunting thing an sa'er can do?

[black_mamba]

Originally Posted by luke

i can understand if ppl are married and in relationships im sure they worked hard to get there but i cant understand how sum ppl with sa can go out on the pull and have lots of flings and one night stands, surely meeting new ppl is the most daunting thing an sa'er can do?

I feel more comfortable with strangers than with friends. They don't have preconceived ideas of me (yet). And yes I DO have social anxiety. So perhaps others feel like me, and that meeting lots of strangers is easier than sustaining a deeper long term friendship.

Regarding the flings - some people just don't find sex as daunting as socialising. They are not the same thing .

[luke]

Originally Posted by black_mamba

I feel more comfortable with strangers than with friends. They don't have preconceived ideas of me (yet). And yes I DO have social anxiety. So perhaps other feel like me, and that meeting lots of strangers is easier than sustaining a deeper long term friendship.

Regarding the flings - some people just don't find sex as daunting as socialising. They are not the same thing .

i dont find sex daunting at all but all the build up towards it like to meet ppl your most likley gonna be in a club or introduced thru friends and i would imagine for most sa'ers going clubbing and haveing friends isnt a common thing.

[dave81uk]

I'm in a relationship, have been for about 10 years now, and she approached me, I could never approach a woman. Its been my only relationship and it been hard, at the start I had to get drunk to even talk to her but all worked out ok in the end

[Medea]

Originally Posted by luke

i dont find sex daunting at all but all the build up towards it like to meet ppl your most likley gonna be in a club or introduced thru friends and i would imagine for most sa'ers going clubbing and haveing friends isnt a common thing.

But that's how YOU find it, like black mamba says some people with SA feel more comfortable with strangers and less SA with them than with family members. This is not how SA effects me, but I can understand it, we're all different, the only thing we have in common is SA (and that's a huge area in itself).

(I like your avatar btw!)

[brighteyes]

I'm married, only just, but was married previously for 8 years, I've suffered sa since early teenage and depression since a child, I was even in a adolescent psych unit for a year when I was 17, so yes you can have relationships and still have sa and other mental health problems.

my ex I met in the unit, was a mistake and ended up more of a dependant relationship, but my new husband I met on the internet and it was the hardest thing I'd ever had to do. I told him of my problems and he was patient... when we first met he did all the talking I couldn't speak and he even sat on a different sofa and stayed at my mums ( he was from scotland)

SA still dominates my life I have 1 friend that took me 10 years before I could have conversation with, good job she was patient too! we only meet up every 6 months or so....

I don't work because I have no confidence or self esteem and panic when around other people, even taking my children to school some days can be a huge task.

so, although I am married I do suffer SA

[Optimistic]

Sometimes you don't have to approach to get a girlfriend. It happens rarely for but it can happen.

Also there is generalised SA and more specialised SA. Someone can have SA an be in a relationship.

Even if someone has severe SA, some people could have a friend they grew up with that they were not shy around. Its not too difficult to imagine a situation where someone with SA is in a relationship.

But I agree with your point that people with SA may be less likely to be in a relationship.

[Ajax Amsterdam]

Originally Posted by Chris P

This is not a rant, neither am I having a dig at people, so here goes...

I honestly can't get my head around the idea that people who post on here who claim to have SA are actually in relationships or married. I really don't understand how exactly you can say you have SA being in this position. Put simply, if you can approach women, the world is you oyster, so to speak.

To me people with SA are more likely to be single and never had a girlfriend or boyfriend in their lives, like me.

Are there any guys on here married? If so, do you really have SA? In my experience, shyness is the route cause of my SA. So obviously being married you must of overcome this problem somehow?

SA - shyness = SA free

What you have said is completely true .... if you also believe that everyone with SA is also gutless, weak and resigned.

This is far from the case though. Many people with SA are also strong, determined and willing.

I can understand where this misconception arrises, but in the wider context it doesn't hold water. Much of my own life has been crippled by SA, but I've also worked my ass off and took risks in order to hold down relationships. This despite SA, not because I was free of SA.

One thing I notice on the site is how some people do a lot of projecting. As in they project their view and rationale on to others. I can see why this happens, but when it does, all the different contexts variables and complexities of life are overlooked and simple, black and white thinking takes place. It's like saying "if I can't see or understand it, it doesn't exist". Facts are though, they do exist whether we can see them or not.

Similarly, many SA people can hold down a relationship. They do so despite it being difficult to do so. Just because someone cannot see how they do it, does not mean they cannot do it.

The sad thing to me is that to believe that people cannot be genuinely SA and also in a relationship, is to unintentionally belittle and devalue the immense pain these people go through and the monumental effort they put in to relationships and into carving out a life for themselves despite their issues.

Being SA doesn't automatically mean you give up on life. You can still have what others have. It just takes more effort and guts to get there despite your issues. In my experience, many SA people are not short of guts and determination to make a life despite their anxiety.

Can you be in a relationship when you have SA? Absolutely you can. It's just a lot harder, that's all.

[Lsb]

Originally Posted by ratty

It's like saying "You can leave the house? You don't have SA" or 'You go to work? You don't have SA". What about people who have friends, do they not have SA either?

It's a sliding scale, everyone experiences things differently and everyone has different struggles and things they find impossible. I find it really weird that people don't seem to understand this.

I'd like to third this (or forth, or whatever).

Disclaimer: bit drunk atm.

My SA messes with my life every day. I don't like going to the supermarket, or answering the phone, despite having to do it almost every day (Hah! Who said exposure therapy worked?).

And I've never even got near a relationship. It's so easy to think 'OMG! how can you *possibly* say you have SA when you got together with someone??//??'

But when it comes down to it, SA is not definable in that sense. Sure, it might really suck (OK, it DOES really suck, I understand!!) that you've never had a partner and potentially never will.

But of those that do, I hear that some can do apparently less than I can, in terms of the supermarket, or the phone, or whatever.

But am I jealous? HELL YEAH!!

Mixed messages But in conclusion, being in a relationship is no reliable indicator of SA.

[SunflowerGirl]

It doesn't bode well for "normal" people to understand our struggles with SA if we doubt and can't understand each other

I was with my last boyfriend for 2 years and my SA didn't go away. Being in a relationship doesn't "cure" you.

[AnimalCrackers]

Originally Posted by Winnie57

As people above have said, SA doesn't rule out having a partner. Some people may have been very lucky in the way they found their partner. Don't assume it's been easy.

Very true. I think you're probably assuming that if someone is in a relationship/married, that they met their partner in the standard way. I met my husband online, which made forming a relationship much easier for me. If there had been no such thing as the internet, I almost certainly would still be alone as I would never have been able to meet someone in the normal way - like in a pub/club etc, or through a friend as I don't have any!!

[AnimalCrackers]

Originally Posted by SunflowerGirl

It doesn't bode well for "normal" people to understand our struggles with SA if we doubt and can't understand each other

Well said!