Never progressing?

[Silent Ninja]

Does anyone else feel that they just haven't ever moved on and are basically still an overly shy, confidence lacking 13/14 year old boy (or girl) that they have always been?

I feel like the road systems and even the landscape round here has changed more than I have in the last 20 odd years.

[waine]

Yes
my brother in one year has got his own car moved in to his own flat and been on holiday to Tenerife

[waine]

And a job

[waine]

I have watched some great tv programs

[Morgana]

Yes. But we're all here now, which means we now know or acknowledge that we have social anxiety, which goes some way to learning to tackle it. It's a start.

[Silent Ninja]

Originally Posted by waine

I have watched some great tv programs

I think that sums up my whole life

[Buddhaboy]

Yep. 25 years for me; was a young man when it started and now I'm well into middle age. Had one relationship which lasted 6 months in that whole time and about 5 years paid work in a part-time job. Have been on the sick again the last year and a half and without much improvement. Have just increased my meds again today in the hope it will get me out of my current rut of swinging from panic states to depressed states to getting really angry because it feels like I''m being mentally tormented and really I've had enough.

[Pathetic_Earthling]

I'm not progressing at all. I've pretty much given up on life and at the age of 47 I'm very bored (boring)

[tryinghard]

I've changed a lot, but I still feel stuck somehow. I wasn't shy when I was 13/14, actually, though I have never had good social skills. I was shy between ages 16 and 26, so the shyness thing doesn't really feel part of me. I do have a kind of social anxiety that hits me unexpectedly when I suddenly feel inadequate or I'm not confident of my skills, or when I'm feeling guilty/feel like I've done something wrong. I find that I don't very much get preoccupied about what I've said in conversations anymore unless I feel guilty. That only seemed to be when I was shy. Now I don't really think about it.

The way I 'am' seems to have changed significantly several times over the course of my life but there's always been something wrong - like there's a kind of knot in my brain - and I struggle to feel satisfied with anything so that's the sense in which I'm stuck. I think it's definitely socially connected, as in feeling very different to other people and so feeling that I don't belong anywhere, but the way that sense of lack is experienced has changed loads (and I think probably got a lot more adaptive as I've got older).

[lone*star]

For me, the whole idea of personal 'progression' is a fallacy - just an idea, born largely out of societal values, of the limited human mind. And maybe that explains why some people have the experience of 'never progressing' in life - because relative to other people they see around them, they simply don't appear to be 'achieving' much, if anything.

But then who/what is it exactly that would be progressing anyhow? Who would be judging the level of progression achieved? How would the progression be measured? And who would be even defining the term 'progression' in the first place? Lots of unanswered questions before we can even get to the one being raised!

Let's face it, at the end of the day, you are what you are within this play we call life. Life itself is in charge of proceedings and is perfectly capable of unfolding under its own steam, without any help from us. So there is no individual doer or chooser of anything, including 'progression'. The whole notion of 'not progressing' is therefore just another excuse to beat yourself up.

I'd say the only real progress anyone can make in life is in the learning, understanding and ultimately the experiencing of truth. Any other type is mere delusion.

[tryinghard]

Originally Posted by lone*star

For me, the whole idea of personal 'progression' is a fallacy - just an idea, born largely out of societal values, of the limited human mind. And maybe that explains why some people have the experience of 'never progressing' in life - because relative to other people they see around them, they simply don't appear to be 'achieving' much, if anything.

But then who/what is it exactly that would be progressing anyhow? Who would be judging the level of progression achieved? How would the progression be measured? And who would be even defining the term 'progression' in the first place? Lots of unanswered questions before we can even get to the one being raised!

Let's face it, at the end of the day, you are what you are within this play we call life. Life itself is in charge of proceedings and is perfectly capable of unfolding under its own steam, without any help from us. So there is no individual doer or chooser of anything, including 'progression'. The whole notion of 'not progressing' is therefore just another excuse to beat yourself up.

I'd say the only real progress anyone can make in life is in the learning, understanding and ultimately the experiencing of truth. Any other type is mere delusion.

Interesting, because I didn't read progression that way. I guess compared with 'the average person', I have physically achieved more if you were going to count it in external or tangible successes, but when asked about progression I did not read it that way. I asked myself whether or not I was happy.

[lone*star]

Originally Posted by tryinghard

Interesting, because I didn't read progression that way. I guess compared with 'the average person', I have physically achieved more if you were going to count it in external or tangible successes, but when asked about progression I did not read it that way. I asked myself whether or not I was happy.

I see the term 'progressing' as covering the whole of a person's life experience - both their external and internal worlds together. And surely the two go hand in hand in any case, do they not? In fact I'd say that they normally tend to mirror each other.

So someone with a generally satisfactory 'outer world' will tend to experience a generally satisfactory 'inner world' (and vice versa). While someone with a generally unsatisfactory outer world will tend to experience a generally unsatisfactory inner world (and vice versa).

And it's interesting to look into why that mirroring effect exists, because it's something that most of us never even consider. While there's clearly a constant two-way interaction between our inner and outer worlds, it seems that the inner world holds the greater importance for us. Which kind of makes sense, in that our own personal thoughts, emotions and sensations appear to be experienced internally and/or through our own physical body.

But because of this greater importance and influence of the inner world, what most people don't tend to realise, is that our inner condition has a profound effect on what we experience outwardly. So much so in fact, that many people even go as far as to say that our outer world is, in some sense at least, actually a projection of our inner world (hence the 'mirroring' effect). "As within, so without". That is obviously another discussion topic of its own!

Going back to your own situation: if there appears to be more of a discord between your outer and inner experiences, and you don't sense the same kind of correlation that I describe above, then maybe it's the case that your outward relative 'successes' in life simply don't equate (in your eyes) as being worthy of being happy about. Which might suggest that maybe you have been following the wrong path in life to some extent, and you may therefore need to think about what makes you truly happy.

[flumpsy]

Like soulastic_ranger I certainly understand myself much more. Materialistically I have progressed but I would say the effort involved is actually more. I am more comfortable with it though, given that for years I thought I was just building up odd unrelated habits and weirdness but now I see the link that connects them all.

I think that is progression, I am certainly progressing through life and feeling less insane.

[tryinghard]

Originally Posted by lone*star

I see the term 'progressing' as covering the whole of a person's life experience - both their external and internal worlds together. And surely the two go hand in hand in any case, do they not? In fact I'd say that they normally tend to mirror each other.

So someone with a generally satisfactory 'outer world' will tend to experience a generally satisfactory 'inner world' (and vice versa). While someone with a generally unsatisfactory outer world will tend to experience a generally unsatisfactory inner world (and vice versa).

And it's interesting to look into why that mirroring effect exists, because it's something that most of us never even consider. While there's clearly a constant two-way interaction between our inner and outer worlds, it seems that the inner world holds the greater importance for us. Which kind of makes sense, in that our own personal thoughts, emotions and sensations appear to be experienced internally and/or through our own physical body.

But because of this greater importance and influence of the inner world, what most people don't tend to realise, is that our inner condition has a profound effect on what we experience outwardly. So much so in fact, that many people even go as far as to say that our outer world is, in some sense at least, actually a projection of our inner world (hence the 'mirroring' effect). "As within, so without". That is obviously another discussion topic of its own!

Going back to your own situation: if there appears to be more of a discord between your outer and inner experiences, and you don't sense the same kind of correlation that I describe above, then maybe it's the case that your outward relative 'successes' in life simply don't equate (in your eyes) as being worthy of being happy about. Which might suggest that maybe you have been following the wrong path in life to some extent, and you may therefore need to think about what makes you truly happy.

I see what you mean now, although I personally think a person with nothing can still be happy, and as we see on the news all the time, a person with everything they ever wanted can be suicidal. I wouldn't, for instance, suggest that Robin Williams didn't want to be a comedian after all...

I think you're right though that it is to do with how you see your external world, but I think that's what creates the external world (in your internal mind). I'm going to get all post-modern about it and say the external world does not really exist in any valuable way to humans, we only have our internal world, because changes in the internal world provide the lens through which we see our externals.

In my case, I've had success, but no amount of success will ever convince me I am successful or talented - I move the goalposts or find other ways to minimise my achievements because I find it very difficult to appreciate them. That would mean changing my mind about myself, which is difficult to do. I do think I'm doing what I want with my life, but I find it empty because I'm never quite good enough.

I think a sense of inadequacy both drives a person towards greater successes (than your average person) and stops them from enjoying any of it.

[Mr. Nobody]

I did realise a while ago that unfortunately, you can only progress by actually GOING THROUGH something,. not skirting around it and avoiding it,.
so, whatever you have managed to avoid is unfortunately still there waiting for you to go though it,
and unless you commit yourself to things, they don't really have much reality to them.

I thought I had carefully and tactfully managed to side-step a whole bunch of stuff in my teens and early twenties and somehow emerge as a "fully grown adult" at the other end having dodged most rights of passage stuff everyone else had to muddle through with earlier,..
nooooooo,.
none shall pass until thy turn is taken on the social merry-go-round., none shall pass.

[flumpsy]

I don't mean to preach here, just adding my own experience on not having to go through the tough stuff in order to make progress, which unfortunately requires a bit of explanation

If you cant be bothered with reading the below then to sum up I would say just break down "progress" into the smallest individual items you can, simplify and tailor those so they are less scary and pick off some you reckon you can achieve.


It is a bit hypothetical as each situation is different and I genuinely believe there are as many root causes of SA as there are SA sufferers but often (I find) you can avoid the parts that cause real problems and still achieve the end goal. Often those bits aren't needed. I still consider that progress. I know it is a strangely pragmatic approach but work out what the "progress" is you want, strip off all the bits you feel you are unable to progress with, and see if you can achieve what is left.

No good examples spring to mind. I have a few rubbish ones.
I wanted a motorbike (midlife crisis I guess) I just can't face the CBT (Compulsory basic training) needed to get a proper motorbike. So I worked out the best way to ride a bike without one. As I progress the CBT will seem more and more achievable, unless I end up in a collection of organ donor cool boxes.

Many of my life choices are made by that method and many of them worked out great. Not all, but many. I think I went a bit far but using it in moderation I think is a good thing.

I cant face hotels. So I camp. Still achieves the goal of going on holiday, getting out and mingling a little bit but without facing the horror that is the uniformed spotty oik leaning over a desk and asking me for my passport. Camping has its issues but I can just about manage them.

So I cant do hotels, have difficulty in airports and cant stand any form of training.
I can go on holiday anywhere that I can drive to (or ride to). Which I did by driving 3000 mile around europe, camping. Some people reckon it was adventurous and I must be very confident. Far from it, just prepared and willing to seem a bit odd in my approach for the sake of my anxiety.

I have started several business, all online from my darkened room behind a pile of Doritos. Some, as they grew I found I couldn't deal with certain aspects so I got out and went a different way, having learn what to avoid.

Making these advances makes it easier to see how I can make more, bigger ones. I am 40 now, I had declined massively from 30-35 years old but the memory of what I could do before (teens and 20s) is still relatively fresh, I was ok back then, I guess that is where my annoying positivity comes from. I couldn't sleep last night, but I actually started thinking how much better I will sleep tonight !! I regularly annoy myself, but I am at work today, after staying up all night anxious and making myself sick with knotted stomach. Sure, I expect everybody thought I was hungover but so what, I made it in. I got here by making small changes over many years until I am doing something I would not have expected. Has to be considered progress even though I regularly curl up in a ball and wait until sunrise because of fear of tomorrow. I also regularly look around and think, flippin eck, by jiminy, look what I did, look what I am doing !!! (I try not to look at what I am going to do, that's when anxiety happens )