"Ageism" rant

[gingercat]

Seems one of the things that upsets me most these days is judgemental, age-related comments from people - not targetted at me necessarily, but just things I see online or hear in real life. I've been really sensitive to it since turning 30, for various reasons. Some examples from the past few months or so:

1. Entire article about how over 30s shouldn't go to music festivals (I didn't read it cos I knew it would only upset me but I saw the link to it)
2. Comment on an article about how "no-one over 30" should be playing computer games
3. Facebook post about how "no-one over 25" should wear clothes from a certain shop (don't remember which one, the name didn't mean anything to me)
4. Poll on a website "Can you ever be too old to get a tattoo?", almost half of people had answered "Yes"
5. Guy at the university walking club I go to saying older people shouldn't join it (ironically he's actually about the same age as me, but he justified his own presence by saying it was ok because he'd first joined when he was much younger)
6. Pub conversation where a load of people jumped in to condemn a relationship someone else was talking about, knowing absolutely nothing about either of the partners except their ages (33 and 22), saying "that's too big a gap"

Is it just me who finds all this kind of... well... offensive? I don't get why it seems to be considered acceptable to be so judgemental about people just because of their age. None of those cases I listed involved anyone doing something that was likely to harm anyone else, so what the hell right does anyone have to tell them they "shouldn't" be doing it? Most of those times I wished I'd had the guts to speak up and question it somehow. Am I the only one who sees a problem with this? It sure feels like it a lot of the time .

I've often been very depressed by the amount of stuff I missed out on while younger, due to SA and depression and related problems. Various times people have tried to reassure me that it's ok because it's not too late and I can still do the stuff I want, but apparently not. When I hear stuff like the above it feels like getting older is actually a minefield of stuff that's acceptable and stuff that isn't, with no logic behind it whatsoever, where anyone can stick their nose into someone else's life and judge them while barely knowing anything about them, what sort of a person they are, or what might be motivating them to act this way.

I guess I have trouble with the whole concept of age groups as well. I was so badly rejected by what felt like my entire peer group that I now dislike the whole assumption that people are going to want to hang out mainly with people their own age. I don't. My age group didn't want me, they rejected me horribly, and now I feel like I've got nothing in common with them because even if I did find some of them that were nice, I haven't got the shared experiences with them after spending so long isolated. So I hate the feeling of expectations that I have to "act my age" or be judged negatively... I have little inclination to do the things others my age are doing right now, or to engage much with them, for reasons that I would say are valid.

I'm actually quite amazed by how well others here seem to deal with all this in comparison to me. Most of you seem quite happy (and do correct me if I've got the wrong impression here) to try to recover and slot back into your own age group, and not go out of your way to make up for lost time or do the stuff you missed out on when younger. Is that because you genuinely have no interest in doing that stuff now? Or because it seems like it would be either impossible or unacceptable to do those things at this point so you might as well forget it?

PS sorry if this doesn't make a lot of sense, been on the beer a bit tonight

[indiegirl1980]

3. Facebook post about how "no-one over 25" should wear clothes from a certain shop (don't remember which one, the name didn't mean anything to me)

I've always been tempted to see if I can get thrown of Hollister and Abercombie for being too old and ugly.

I don't think that 33 and 22 is that big a gap. The gap between a 20 year old going out with a 15 year is bigger.

[Progress]

Originally Posted by gingercat

Is it just me who finds all this kind of... well... offensive? I don't get why it seems to be considered acceptable to be so judgemental about people just because of their age.

It's just people's opinions. Everyone has different opinions, and lets face it most of them are crap I would suggest you just try and ignore them if you can and fit in with whoever you can in whatever age group.

Originally Posted by gingercat

Most of you seem quite happy (and do correct me if I've got the wrong impression here) to try to recover and slot back into your own age group, and not go out of your way to make up for lost time or do the stuff you missed out on when younger. Is that because you genuinely have no interest in doing that stuff now? Or because it seems like it would be either impossible or unacceptable to do those things at this point so you might as well forget it?

I guess I do regret some of the things I missed out on when younger, but I suppose regretting gets you nowhere in life. Life is about now and the future, the past is gone. To an extent you have to be realistic about what is and isn't possible but if you want to do something then go for it. Don't be put off by one person saying they don't think it's right.

[Cleo]

When I see people of my age group in clothes that might be considered right for younger people, they either look just as good in them or not, depending on their body shape, etc.

I never enjoyed part of my thirties as I was in charge of a younger secretary who constantly made me feel ancient. Now I regret it so much. I regard the thirties as a wonderful decade. My mother used to say, 'It's a time of life you should enjoy, as you ought have gained a bit of sense by then.'

I am reminded of a film called, Carrosal (spelt that incorrectly). Where they were all killed at thirty on the pretext of being reborn.

How I earth do the majority of people know if you are twenty-five or thirty. In my thirties I still looked twenty-one. Go out and grab life, girl.

[Cleo]

Originally Posted by Cynic

That's not for them to decide (unless they're running the doors obv.) who can or can't go to one.


As it is a walking club I do find that a bit strange. In saying that, I've felt slightly uncomfortable going to boxing gyms at my age as nearly everyone else in there is in their 20's or teens and wonder if I may stand out. :-/


Could be jealousy. I knew a guy who described a 40-year-old bloke as a paedo cause he was going out with a bird in his 20's.


FWIW I've got more of a problem with people sticking their noses into other people's (consenting adults obv.) affairs for all kinds of reasons.


Live your life for you - not for anyone else.

Arguing for the sake of it is boorish, which is why I can't be bothered to reply to any posts you put up.

Unless they abdicate that right, every one deserves to be treated with respect, Cynic,

[Progress]

Originally Posted by Cleo

Arguing for the sake of it is boorish, which is why I can't be bothered to reply to any posts you put up.

Unless they abdicate that right, every one deserves to be treated with respect, Cynic,

You've reacted against Cynic's posts before, and I think you are reacting to the 'tone' rather than the substance of what he says. His stye is a very matter of fact one but in fact everything he has said above is trying to counter the negative thoughts and I guess offer advice in that way. I don't see argument for the sake of it.

[Cleo]

Originally Posted by rainbowsky

don't really get the whole age thing tbh, why is being under 30 deemed as better? don't get it. does everyone think they're going to be under 30 forever, believe me you'll be 40 afore you know it, and it's no worse than any other age. it's what you do with your time that matters, not the amount of years you've been on the planet.

So true!

[Mr. Nobody]

Originally Posted by gingercat

one of the things that upsets me most these days is judgemental, age-related comments from things I see online or hear in real life.? I don't get why it seems to be considered acceptable to be so judgemental about people just because of their age.

I'm wondering if the core of recognised 'modern society' is becomong more angled towards youth-oriented concerns & interests.

could be also that you're moving in circles where younger people predominate and so you're within earshot of negative, ageist comments.. not sure.
I get those comments too, but I can see how immature the people are who use them, it's laughable,.. perhaps suffering fools gladly is giving those fools credibilty they don't deserve?

perhaps what older people have to contribute to society is getting overlooked or even ignored.
there's not a lot of appreciation of what maturity, experience,and age can bring,..
add to that, that some younger people do tend to see old age as a kind of failing or lack of credibility somehow, maybe we should be more vocal about what we have to offer rather than doffing our cap to all that's young.

I by no means subscribe to society and it's dictates, but it's reach and influence is more or less inescapable in our daily lives.

things in the 'visible', obvious aspects of society seem pitched towards promoting and glorifying activities and interests that the younger generation generally indulge in.

personally, I can't see what the attraction is for the younger generation,.. they'll pretty quickly be the older generation, and so it goes on.

[Cleo]

I am constantly surprised by the courtesy extended by younger people and how they go out of their way to instil this politeness into their children. When I talk to younger people they readily reciprocate and I find that age is no barrier whatsoever as, indeed, it should not be. Of course, there are those that think youth is a virtue in itself, as, indeed is beauty. They too will one day be old and what goes around... A great pity this does not apply to the rough estate in which I live, where the feral children literally caused havoc in my garden - although, to be fair, this has now stopped.

[gingercat]

Thanks all for the replies .

I would maybe find it more understandable if those sort of comments were actually coming from younger people, after all they can't know first hand what it's like to get older and may still believe their feelings are going to change at 25/30/35/whatever. But a lot of it comes from people my age or older. At the walking group for example I've never been made to feel unwelcome by any of the younger ones (it's a university-based group BTW, that's why they're mostly young), only by this guy who's about my age. I can't help wondering whether in some cases it is (like Cynic says) jealousy, maybe these people have given up doing certain things they used to enjoy for whatever reason and they feel resentful to see others still doing those things so they feel the need to attack them. Surely if they were happy in their own lives they wouldn't be so judgemental of others.

Originally Posted by Charlotte87

You are only 30 and can do all the things that you missed out on. Why do you feel that you can't? What are the things that you would like to do?

I've started to try and do most of them now. I started going to gigs for the first time last year, haven't done a music festival yet but I'd really like to. I'd also like to travel round Europe staying in hostels like lots of people do on gap years, I probably can't get enough time off work to do it for long but am trying to fit in a few days of it whenever I get the chance. I feel I've missed out on a lot of relationship stuff but I have a very understanding partner now and we're trying to do something about that. And I enjoy being involved in the uni walking club and dance class I joined a few years ago so would like to stay at those a while longer. Aside from that I just want to hang out with people and have fun as much as possible having not had much chance to do that in my teens and early 20s.

I guess I'm not being prevented from doing any of it and mostly people are friendly and supportive enough... I'm not sure why these random comments get to me so much but I feel a bit better for reading the responses to this thread as it's clear not everyone agrees with them.

Originally Posted by Indiegirl1980

I don't think that 33 and 22 is that big a gap. The gap between a 20 year old going out with a 15 year is bigger.

I agree... OK, it's a bigger age gap than most, but I would say nowhere near big enough to be able to say "That's wrong" or "That's not going to work out" without knowing either of the people. Just seems very judgemental to me.

Originally Posted by Essenes

perhaps what older people have to contribute to society is getting overlooked or even ignored.
there's not a lot of appreciation of what maturity, experience,and age can bring,..

I would agree with that too. I see it a lot in my line of work (computer programming) where people can be considered "past it" at 35 or 40 by some employers... despite the fact that in reality they probably have a better understanding and broader knowledge than the ones just out of uni. I know I've got WAY better at doing my job as I've got more experienced and I don't see that starting to go backwards any time soon.

[gingercat]

Don't let that put you off learning if it's something you enjoy. Not all employers are like that... my current one seems a bit more enlightened. And age discrimination in the workplace is technically illegal now anyway, so hopefully in time it will get more difficult for the employers who try to judge people that way .

[The Pearl Fisher]

I went to my first music festival this year, and I had a great time (I'm 45). Slept in a tent, up to my knees in mud, great music and great beer. Plan to do more next year!

[Effervescing Elephant]

I get fed up reading some of these articles. I think they're written by people trying to be funny or superior (or both) - they have to sneer at someone and there aren't a lot of acceptable targets left. Writing that you should have stopped doing X by thirty us a way of saying "yes, I used to like doing that but I've outgrown it - I'm more sophisticated and more mature than you are. I've moved on. "

It's true that our society is very youth-orientated - I guess that's because they have the disposable income and everybody else wants to lech over their bodies.

My learned conclusion - **** them all and the ridiculously expensive bicycles they rode in on. Sideways.

(I'm very glad I'm so old no-one expects me to go to nightclubs or music festivals any more though)

[gingercat]

Originally Posted by Effervescing Elephant

I get fed up reading some of these articles. I think they're written by people trying to be funny or superior (or both) - they have to sneer at someone and there aren't a lot of acceptable targets left.

I've had that thought myself sometimes - I guess the bigotted idiots will have had to move onto something else now that racism, homophobia, etc. aren't so acceptable these days.

Writing that you should have stopped doing X by thirty us a way of saying "yes, I used to like doing that but I've outgrown it - I'm more sophisticated and more mature than you are. I've moved on. "

Exactly. I think this is what winds me up the most actually... maybe giving up on "young people stuff" at that time of their life was right for them, and that's fine, but people are all different so they can't possibly know whether the same thing would be right for anyone else. (Of course, if they were genuinely mature and sophisticated, they would probably realise that). When I reached 30 I felt like I'd barely started on all the stuff people do when they're young, so I sure as hell didn't feel ready to give it up yet (and still don't).

(I'm very glad I'm so old no-one expects me to go to nightclubs or music festivals any more though)

I've never liked nightclubs so it's no big loss if I don't get invited clubbing anymore. I'd like to try at least one music festival though.

[disdain]

I'm thirty five (and a half!) and I have never been to a music festival. I totally have intentions to do loads of things I missed out on over the next ten years. Including travelling and stuff. Keep in touch and I'll go with you! Plus I'm planning on disappearing for a few weeks on my 40th. Going to tell the mrs I'm 'going out for a paper and milk..' one morning. Then reappear the following month.