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  #61  
Old 26th May 2012, 19:42
Progress Progress is offline
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Default Re: Relationships - anyone given up?

Quote:
Originally Posted by kingandduck
It probably doesn't help that the girls I'm attracted to are always really popular and sociable.
I often wonder this, are a lot of people single because they're attracted to the 'wrong type of person' (I think it's partly true for me).
Can we change who we're attracted to? I often think we need to.
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  #62  
Old 26th May 2012, 19:49
kingandduck kingandduck is offline
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Default Re: Relationships - anyone given up?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Progress
I often wonder this, are a lot of people single because they're attracted to the 'wrong type of person' (I think it's partly true for me).
Can we change who we're attracted to? I often think we need to.
Nah, you are attracted to who you are attracted to. You can't change that nor should you.

I know when I really really really like a girl. How do I know? Because those are the only girls I actually really consider pursuing or pursue with my SA.

There are a lof of girls I've thought, "damn, they are really nice, but no way am I going to bother". But there have only been 2-3 girls in my life to date where I've thought "damn, she's absolutely perfect, I've GOT to go for this. **** the SA!"

I'm on that 3rd girl now and have been for 2 plus years LOL. Haven't had the balls to go for it yet but am thinking I'm going to in some shape or form.
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  #63  
Old 26th May 2012, 19:58
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Default Re: Relationships - anyone given up?

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Originally Posted by Cynic
Aye, for everyone who fits a certain standard. If you fail to meet the acceptable (largely unspoken) criteria, then you're out of luck.
rubbish you've just got to find your equal in the opposite sex, it makes sense that if you yourself exist then that means your equal in the opposite sex is able to and should exist as well.

if you're saying they can never exist then you're stating that you can't exist either!
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  #64  
Old 26th May 2012, 20:00
kingandduck kingandduck is offline
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Default Re: Relationships - anyone given up?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobazaw
rubbish you've just got to find your equal in the opposite sex, it makes sense that if you yourself exist then that means your equal in the opposite sex is able to and should exist as well.

if you're saying they can never exist then you're stating that you can't exist either!
And what are the odds of you finding that person withing range of where you live? Incredibly small.
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  #65  
Old 26th May 2012, 20:44
davehedgehog
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Default Re: Relationships - anyone given up?

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Originally Posted by kingandduck
And what are the odds of you finding that person withing range of where you live? Incredibly small.
if you take on a negative attitude towards it then yeah they're pretty small.
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  #66  
Old 26th May 2012, 20:58
kingandduck kingandduck is offline
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Default Re: Relationships - anyone given up?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobazaw
if you take on a negative attitude towards it then yeah they're pretty small.
Just being real.
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  #67  
Old 26th May 2012, 21:01
diplodocus diplodocus is offline
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Default Re: Relationships - anyone given up?

Quote:
Originally Posted by kingandduck
I don't think you can hide the fact that you aren't very sociable. I mean as soon as someone gets to know you, it becomes obvious, right?
Yeah but the idea being that by that stage you have got them interested rather than just getting cut off before they got to see your good points. At least that's how I see it You wouldn't meet someone and straight away tell them all your bad points would you? You're not hiding it in that way you are just aren't making a big deal out of it.
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  #68  
Old 26th May 2012, 21:21
T T is online now
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Default Re: Relationships - anyone given up?

I've been on POF and OkCupid for abit now but feeling like giving it up to be honest i do message people but most of the time it gets ignored... whats they point at the end of the day is all you do is get ignored...
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  #69  
Old 26th May 2012, 23:21
Mr. Nobody Mr. Nobody is offline
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Default Re: Relationships - anyone given up?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rufus
There was just the one girl at work during 20 years really when I was much younger who I found myself looking at instinctively, found through other people she liked me and then I pissed myself when I realised that she was expecting me to ask her out so basically gave up and tried not to look at anyone ever again. Although she of course then thought I was weird and strange and told all the other girls I was mental so that didn't help.I dont feel the slightest bit of guilt though as I am led to believe I am supposed to as I was so shy then even the smallest small talk would have me a blushing mind blank zombie so even if we lived in a world where women chased men it would have been no different.
I found that quite a sad story Rufus,..

so similar to mine,..

I'm often at such a loss to explain what SA is,.. how can we be so encaged in fear and dread when it comes to what should supposedly be a natural, passionate time for us,..?

when I think back to all those incidents where I was about to approach a Woman and was just stopped in my tracks by an almost physical barrier preventing me from moving any further, struck dumb, almost immobile, like some kind of invisible barrier was suddenly brought crashing down and which seemed to sap all my confidence, all my joy, all my intelligence,.. and I had to retreat back to my enforced solitude.

it was so odd that I even wondered if someone had hynotised me in my childhhod to make it so I'd never be able to have relationships,. it was that odd, and seemingly inexplicable.
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  #70  
Old 26th May 2012, 23:31
davehedgehog
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Default Re: Relationships - anyone given up?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cynic
They most probably do exist, but they'll either want someone superior, or do without.
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  #71  
Old 27th May 2012, 13:56
diplodocus diplodocus is offline
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Default Re: Relationships - anyone given up?

Quote:
Originally Posted by kingandduck
Nah, you are attracted to who you are attracted to. You can't change that nor should you.

I know when I really really really like a girl. How do I know? Because those are the only girls I actually really consider pursuing or pursue with my SA.

There are a lof of girls I've thought, "damn, they are really nice, but no way am I going to bother". But there have only been 2-3 girls in my life to date where I've thought "damn, she's absolutely perfect, I've GOT to go for this. **** the SA!"

I'm on that 3rd girl now and have been for 2 plus years LOL. Haven't had the balls to go for it yet but am thinking I'm going to in some shape or form.
ha ha this is very true. While thankfully I am much better these days, in the past those are about the only times I managed to conquer my crippling anxiety but there have been many more times where I've just bottled it. I regret those times a lot but it's not that I think of what might have been really as those people were just strangers and I can't even really remember much about them. No what gets me is the feeling of failure and cowardice. That's what really burns me.
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  #72  
Old 27th May 2012, 13:57
diplodocus diplodocus is offline
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Default Re: Relationships - anyone given up?

Quote:
Originally Posted by surelynot
I do wish men and women could feel free to chat each other up equally....

I would love to approach men but the ones I'm attracted to are always so beautiful I'd just embarrass myself
Well there are some women who do just that, admittedly they are a minority and sometimes guys don't like an overally direct or forward approach. But any woman who goes up and starts chatting to guys not necessarily chatting up, just being friendly will find them self being very successful. And there is nothing to stop women doing this.

However, many more women while they may not approach per se do a lot more than just stand around and wait. It's just a lot more indirect and subtle. They'll come into your space unnecessarily, flirt, look in your direction, make eye contact, makes excuses to be around you, and communicate through body language that they are attracted.

Basically all you have to do in some cases is go up and just talk to them and you're in. I think a lot of the guys who are successful with women are the ones who read the signs better and will act on them, not because they can charm any woman within a 5 mile radius.
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  #73  
Old 27th May 2012, 14:01
diplodocus diplodocus is offline
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Default Re: Relationships - anyone given up?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rufus
Thanks, yes, I suppose its the classic fight or flight response they talk about from caveman days. I wonder why approaching a female brought upon the same symptoms as fighting a cave-lion though. For me it was the physical signs of SA which I was so ashamed and embarrassed by, blushing, sweating and stammering and I had no control over. I always thought trying to talk with severe SA similar in embarrassment to farting uncontrollably like an elephant when talking to someone and then being told to keep trying anyway because you will get better at it. Once the word goes round work that you are the weird bloke it gets harder and you become paranoid that everyone is laughing at you and then there is also the creepy aspect that shy men often get accused of if they go around trying to chat women up. The fear of ridicule was so great that avoidance became the sensible thing to do.
My guess is that it's because there is a lot of the line (i.e. a potential mate of high value) and if you mess it up, then you may only get that one chance. Also you mention the 'word' going round that you are the weird bloke. I agree this is absolute death to your chances or at the least it will make it very hard. Social proof is absolutely vital to guys if they are to be successful with women. So again that's another reason I think that we get such a flight or fight response. You could lose not only one potential mate but many in one botched attempt! I bet that makes all shy guys feel even better now
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  #74  
Old 27th May 2012, 14:11
kingandduck kingandduck is offline
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Default Re: Relationships - anyone given up?

I don't have a problem with the male having to do the chasing. I just have a problem with SA!

The more I think about it, I just can't see any scenario where I don't come off as a total loser. Really wanting to for it, and am tempted, but I can't see any relationships happening until I build more of a social life with just friends first. Which probably isn't going to happen anytime soon, so I can kiss good bye to this girl..
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  #75  
Old 27th May 2012, 16:27
diplodocus diplodocus is offline
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Default Re: Relationships - anyone given up?

Quote:
Originally Posted by kingandduck
but I can't see any relationships happening until I build more of a social life with just friends first. Which probably isn't going to happen anytime soon, so I can kiss good bye to this girl..
I came to this very same conclusion, I could have had relationships with out doing that, but not the ones I really wanted. Took a few years but it was the best thing I ever did.
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  #76  
Old 28th May 2012, 10:54
syncsolo syncsolo is offline
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Default Re: Relationships - anyone given up?

I've not given up but I'm not actively trying to find someone either. It seems pointless as things stand at the moment in my life. E.g Lack of money, bleak prospects, still living at home. No women would want to date me now unless I lied about my life, it complicates things being in this position at my age.
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  #77  
Old 28th May 2012, 12:29
Mr. Nobody Mr. Nobody is offline
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Default Re: Relationships - anyone given up?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rufus
it was the physical signs of SA which I was so ashamed and embarrassed by, blushing, sweating and stammering and I had no control over.you become paranoid that everyone is laughing at you The fear of ridicule was so great that avoidance became the sensible thing to do.
yip,.. my story exactly I'm afraid.

in answer to the earlier thing about the 'caveman' fear response being similar to being attacked by a lion etc.
I was at an anxiety/stress course and learned a bit from that,..: for our bodies there's no difference from being attacked by a predator or talking to a woman, ..
the brain just responds in the same way,..
I suppose it's our job to try and see that the fear is unneccessary,..
the body/mind is simply responding to our perception of danger, and the unconscious automatic responses simply take over,..
ironically, it is often these responses that caused most of the grief.
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  #78  
Old 28th May 2012, 12:36
Mr. Nobody Mr. Nobody is offline
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Default Re: Relationships - anyone given up?

Quote:
Originally Posted by diplodocus
many women while they may not approach per se do a lot more than just stand around and wait. It's just a lot more indirect and subtle. They'll come into your space unnecessarily, flirt, look in your direction, make eye contact, makes excuses to be around you, and communicate through body language that they are attracted.

Basically all you have to do in some cases is go up and just talk to them and you're in. I think a lot of the guys who are successful with women are the ones who read the signs better and will act on them,.
yes !!

I now know this to be true also,..
I think maybe SA people are either just not able to read signs, not confident enough to imagine the signs are actually true, or simply too anxious to make use of those signs.

I tend to recognise what signs and situations a woman was putting out there a few weeks or months after she gave up on me, and it was only on reflection that I realized how clever and subtle she'd been in giving me so many opportunities ( however elusive ) to talk to her.
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  #79  
Old 28th May 2012, 14:39
kingandduck kingandduck is offline
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Default Re: Relationships - anyone given up?

I'm terrible at reading signs. Or should I say, I'm terrible at believing the signs are actually signs.

For example one of many possible signs.....

last Thursday I was about to enter the office or where this bird works. She sees me coming through the window and quickly gets up. I think "why is she running off?" I get into her office to collect something on the side and see she has gone around collecting all the coffee mugs on a tray so she could leave the office with me. We both walk out the door into the hallway and she starts a conversation with me. We talk for like 5 minutes until one of her colleagues comes down the hall and kind of looks at us both with a smile. The conversation ends and she says bye.

Now reading that, it sure as hell seems like a sign to me, but in my head, I think I'm imaging it all. LOL.
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  #80  
Old 28th May 2012, 15:19
Johnni Johnni is offline
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Default Re: Relationships - anyone given up?

^ What were you thinking at the time when it was happening?

Im not the best at reading signs but i kinda feel i know what is and when it isn't kinda thing however i never see any signs with me...ever, ah well.
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  #81  
Old 28th May 2012, 16:27
kingandduck kingandduck is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnni
^ What were you thinking at the time when it was happening?
Shall we just take our clothes off now?
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  #82  
Old 28th May 2012, 18:44
Johnni Johnni is offline
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Default Re: Relationships - anyone given up?

Quote:
Originally Posted by kingandduck
I'm terrible at reading signs. Or should I say, I'm terrible at believing the signs are actually signs................

Now reading that, it sure as hell seems like a sign to me, but in my head, I think I'm imaging it all. LOL.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kingandduck
Shall we just take our clothes off now?
So it was kinda like you saw it but couldn't believe it was real and happening to you?
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  #83  
Old 28th May 2012, 19:03
kingandduck kingandduck is offline
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Default Re: Relationships - anyone given up?

I saw it, but then when I come away, it's like did that really all happen, or am I just overreacting?

I guess she is in to me considering all the other signs. Unless she's outrageously friendly and flirty..

Anyway, I guess the signs mean very little because she doesn't know the real me. I guess she just assumes I have a nice little social life like most normal people.
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  #84  
Old 28th May 2012, 19:13
Johnni Johnni is offline
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Default Re: Relationships - anyone given up?

Quote:
Originally Posted by kingandduck

Anyway, I guess the signs mean very little because she doesn't know the real me. I guess she just assumes I have a nice little social life like most normal people.
Nah forget all that crap even if you did get to know her and you see a negative reaction to her finding the 'real' you as you say at least you tried. I doubt that will happen anyway as like others have said after a while and if you told her stuff about you i doubt she will care much.
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  #85  
Old 28th May 2012, 19:20
Johnni Johnni is offline
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Default Re: Relationships - anyone given up?

Quote:
Originally Posted by AlienBuddha
I just think men should consider toning down the creepiness and desperation of chasing after women and women consider stopping this petty submissiveness of standing demurely on a pedestal waiting for Mr A-hole to woo and charm them.

As I said before, I just find some men's logic baffling along the lines of towards women as "I'm a woman, please come and pester me for sex and/or a relationship in public". Sexual harassment towards women has always been a problem and seemingly is on the increase... I'm just (feebly) trying to advocate a fine balance between the sexes when it comes to indicating an interest in one another.
Quote:
Originally Posted by diplodocus
Approaching people of the opposite sex that you find attractive doesn't have to be creepy or desperate, in fact that type of approach is the exact opposite of what works! Some use the pester approach, and it may work for them with some women but on the whole they are the ones losing out. And women believe or not don't want someone who acts like an A-hole as you put it and puts them on a pedestal. There are a few like that but many more who aren't.
I have to agree and see where you are coming from AB cos i'm kinda the same. I kinda cringe thinking about guys chatting up women etc cos i think all women's first reaction is to think they are a creep etc. Even online i rarely initiate contact with women for the same reason and even try not to give off any vibes with women i have met irl that i liked them etc cos i fear i will scare them away even if i had no desire to get in their pants. I think you are the same in a sense with regards to the same outlook but as Diplodocus said most approaches aren't like this and probably the desperate/creepy types won't work as well as the more sincere ones.
Therefore i understand the reluctance to 'play the game' if you see it like this as i do but it's not like how we see it but more 'clean' and respectful than we think it is.
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  #86  
Old 28th May 2012, 19:25
Johnni Johnni is offline
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Default Re: Relationships - anyone given up?

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Originally Posted by Only_human
I think girl's think they want this outgoing, social butterfly but actually quite a lot, deep down, would like someone who while is happy to go out with them when they want, is quite happy to stay at home a lot of the time and they don't have to worry about going off clubbing alone and getting drunk and encouraged by their mates to stray etc. But saying you want someone who's not outgoing, just makes you sound like a bunny boiler so they end up being like cattle and putting the obvious traits everyone suppoedly likes in people.
I agree, i think what happens is people state what they want yet they kinda do so cos it seems the more acceptable right answer. Everyone seems to write the same stuff on a dating profile cos if you say you don't go out much etc then its kinda seen as a negative.
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  #87  
Old 28th May 2012, 19:35
Johnni Johnni is offline
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Default Re: Relationships - anyone given up?

Quote:
Originally Posted by diplodocus
Basically all you have to do in some cases is go up and just talk to them and you're in. I think a lot of the guys who are successful with women are the ones who read the signs better and will act on them, not because they can charm any woman within a 5 mile radius.
I think this is very true. I think that is why on this site it seems most think its the other way round in that you need to have certain skills to attract & charm a woman (hence all the PUA/creepyness comments) cos it kinda gives you a excuse as to the lack of effort some put into it cos you can't do that but others can and some of us refuse to play that way. If what you say is true then we can only really blame ourselves for not acting on it cos we don't have to charm them and bullshit them.
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  #88  
Old 29th May 2012, 03:02
failquail failquail is offline
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Default Re: Relationships - anyone given up?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobazaw
there there is someone for everyone so you shouldn't have to hide who you are".
This is one viewpoint i wish i could burn away.

At 32YO, i've had many years of blind optimism that that was the case.

It probably took too long, but i'm now trying to deal with the fallout of half a lifetime's blind optimism falling apart around me. It would have hurt initially, but hiding the problem behind optimism only amplified the problem, now i'm a complete wreck.

There is no-one for me and i wish i could have been told this a decade or two ago. It's tearing me apart :/
Blind optimism is a very dangerous thing. Good if it works well yet highly toxic if it doesn't. I wish more would consider the dangers of it...
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  #89  
Old 29th May 2012, 19:41
piesJoy piesJoy is offline
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Cool Re: Relationships - anyone given up?

Had a few r/s ages ago but to be honest still feel I wouldn't know where to start. Trying to be positive though....
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  #90  
Old 29th May 2012, 20:02
diplodocus diplodocus is offline
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Default Re: Relationships - anyone given up?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rufus
No, but he had invited himself round my house once to play computer games and also called when I was out so you would think he wouldn't mind. However by that stage perhaps he had realised I wasn't friend material any more and being SA I had not realised and was still somewhat sad lonely and desperate which of course often repels people.
Maybe he was just a bit funny that you called him at work? Some people can be a bit off about that.
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