Your Children and SA

[Spuggy]

How do you find bringing up your children whilst coping / living with SA?


I ask because I've found my own behaviour odd at times.

Ultimately, I seem to keep my children at arms length and dont overly commit to them emotionally.

What I mean is I redirect them to their mum and subconsciously dont get involved in knowing what theyre doing at school or their personal lives too. Of course living with them means I pickup the headlines of what theyre doing but I tend to keep it that way. I dont get involved in the details.

I say subconsciously because I do it without thinking and yet it makes me feel sad that this is my natural position. I am embarrassed daily when their mum can talk to them about the intricacies of their lives. Their school work and private lives etc. But I think I know why I do it.

I used to think it was because Im simply not interested but it isnt that because I am interested. I wish I could be like their mum. No, I believe I keep it this way so that my exit may be made easier.

Long before my children were born I have fantasised about running away or more accurately, living alone and away from everyone. I joke with my wife that when I leave Im going to move to Carlisle. Just a random place I chose out the way from everyone I know. Ive carried this sense of a want to be alone for years, its such a strong feeling. Im pretty sure that this all stems from my SA and it is this that creates this emotional gap between myself and my children. Just enough gap to make me believe that a move away is always an option. A good option, the right option.

The truth is, I wish I was closer to them and I wish my natural stance wasnt this way but theyre at an age now where they know what position their dad takes in their lives, they can see a slight oddness in my behaviour or at least in my head they can which in turn makes me feel a greater sense of oddness in my head. Its mad. An almost vicious circle.

I know that if I could just switch my behaviour, get off this horse if you like, then I could form a better, more meaningful relationship with them. I just cant seem to make that adjustment. Im racked with so much self doubt and have flown through most of my 46 years being scared of life, hiding behind anything I could whilst carrying with me huge suitcases empty of confidence. Everyday just seems like a struggle.


Its so hard and frustrating. My children dont ever see the best of me and as such, I feel that I fail them every single day.



How do you cope or get by with yours?



S

[Bored]

"I just cant seem to make that adjustment." I suppose try and find out why you cant, have you tried therapy

[Dougella]

^ I also think talking about this with a therapist could be a good idea.

I don't have children so I can't comment from that perspective. I'm thinking that maybe your children probably won't notice much when they're young as it will just be normal to them, but when they get to be older teenagers/young adults they may start to wonder about what's going on with their Dad and why.

[Aelwyn]

I don't have children, but some of what you say does ring a bell with me. When things are particularly stressful I sometimes think I'd like to be some kind of hermit, completely alone in the wilds, completely self-sufficient. But when I think about what that woud really be like, I'm aware it is total fantasy.

Perhaps some of us always have to live with that kind of tension - needing other people in many ways, but also longing to get away from the pressures that they bring. Perhaps it's even true for everybody to some extent - I think I read somewhere that if a person is alone in a room, and another person (even someone they love) enters the room, their stress level always rises.

It does sound as if you are feeling this very strongly, and it's causing you to feel distressed and guilty. I agree with others above that counselling could help, I think meditation also might be useful.

In the meantime would it be possible for you to experiment with some very small changes in how you are with your children? Maybe taking them out for a walk once a week, watching a film with them, some regular thing that they could look forward to? Then noticing how you feel about that, and if it starts to get any easier?

[Mr. Nobody]

again,. I'm afraid I'm a poster who doesn't have children, but I did wonder about something,

what if you somehow see yourself as weak, due to SA,
you want your children to grow up to be strong and confident,
so, perhaps on some level you have created distance because of how you view yourself?
perhaps you subconsciously don't want your SA to influence their own behaviour, or for yourself to be seen as 'weak'?
so, you may have kept yourself on the fringes, imagining that this is some form of protection for them?

I think they would love to see your softer side,
some supposed weaknesses are actually strengths when viewed at a different level.

you will all be the richer for it if you can just be who you are around them.

[Spuggy]

Originally Posted by Aelwyn

When things are particularly stressful I sometimes think I'd like to be some kind of hermit, completely alone in the wilds, completely self-sufficient. But when I think about what that would really be like, I'm aware it is total fantasy.

In the meantime would it be possible for you to experiment with some very small changes in how you are with your children? Maybe taking them out for a walk once a week, watching a film with them, some regular thing that they could look forward to? Then noticing how you feel about that, and if it starts to get any easier?

The feelings that that have stirred in me over these past 20 or so years are always there, I cant remember when they started tbh. I think its a result of finding people such hard work and stressful. Whenever negative moments occur, such as an argument with the wife or some other downbeat scenario then yes the desire to carryout this long held plan is burning at the forefront of my mind but never goes away completely. I believe its the outcome from a life spent short of confidence and total lack of self-belief. It feels like these negative feelings have bundled themselves up, added a bit of extra spice and repackaged themselves up as SA.

With regards to my children and despite my original posting. Ive not entirely shut myself off to them. I do enjoy doing different activities with them. My youngest, we enjoy certain types of films together and as her dad im often the goto for various requests be it fixing her bike, or sorting her laptop out etc. Dad things really. My eldest, we enjoy football together. I take her to play with her local team. We go watch football together (dare I say at Anfield) whenever we can get tickets. Its kinda our thing, and we come together to watch matches on the TV too. They both come to me also for clothing advice or what to wear because mum just hasnt a clue.

I do have my role and I have tried to be there as much as possible. Ive worked 100% home for the past 12 years and have always been here for them both.

I guess what they cant see is the struggle im faced withy behind these eyes. Of knowing just how much theyre not getting from me, how much I hide and want to hide. How hard it is to keep it up. It does take its toll.

I do tend to 'keep up appearances' try not let the mask slip but I do see the odd furrowed brow from my girls as their dads reaction to something was a little off and confusing but I mostly keep my sh*t together if I can.

Occasionally and often late at night after I've knocked a bottle of vino down my neck at the weekend AND once everyone is in bed. I have a little cry to myself, acknowledging the struggle and just how much better it could be for my girls.

There are times when I just think 'Oh shut up. Just smile, ignore all this internal BS and go kick some ass' A gee-up if you will and it helps for a little while.


Before running my own business I used to work in IT where I would provide networking and support services to a site with over 500 people and in my time there I got to know most of them to speak to. I was well of aware of confidence issues back then and have come to realise that the no-option constant interacting with people seemed to help stave off what has become SA. I had no choice. It kept it under wraps. I now work for myself and run a 100% Online business with 1 part-time member of staff. I work in the corner of my house by myself most of the time and have done for 12 years. its hasnt helped at all. Ive often wondered if me ending up working on my own (mostly) is somehow linked to my desire to live on my own and that some kind of subconscious SA goal has been reached.


Anyway, geeez, I do go on, Sorry.

[Spuggy]

Originally Posted by Nanuq

I think recognising that you're emotionally detached is very self aware and that you want to change that is a very positive thing. Your children will be aware and affected by your emotional detachment, so whether or not you see yourself as a permanent fixture in the family unit, for their sakes it is definitely worth seeking help for it.
I don't feel that I am emotionally distant from my children, but I do think that it's possibly easier to cope with the emotional issues of SA and parenting as a mother. Mothering from birth is very hands on and nurturing and there are people around you, like health visitors, who will pick up if a mother seems emotionally detached or not bonded to their child and would help. Men are always (rightly or wrongly) secondary. So I can imagine not getting over that emotional defence mechanism is tougher.
There's been times more recently, now my children are teenagers and can be emotionally difficult themselves, where my own emotional dysfunction has come back in a very frightening way and I have shut down and felt like I was doing a bad job and that by my leaving the family home it would benefit everyone. Obviously that's not true, but I have believed it very strongly at the time.
Whatever has caused your SA and your emotional detachment, it isn't your fault. But your children will grow up and move away anyway, so I think it's definitely worth it to find ways to bond with them, so that you can build a relationship that will last into their future. Does your wife ever talk to you about your relationship with them?
You don't say how old your children are? Mine are 16 and 14 and I have found the teenage years quite difficult.

I think the hardest thing, has been trying to the keep that emotional gap as small possible. If I asked them, theyd probably not even know and just think , 'well dads funny anyway, thats just normal'. But I think this is what is the most tiring. Keeping it together and trying my upmost to keep that gap as small as possible even though its like a gaping chasm in my mind.

I have to agree and feel your pain re the teenage years. My eldest will be 14 next month (my youngest is 11) and she can be a thunderstorm at any given minute. The ferocity in her willingness to push me away is hard to handle and really does rock my emotional state where I begin questioning why I bother to even talk to her.

My wife is aware of my social anxiety and thus my confidence issues and I've joked with her about settling in Carlisle although I think she sees this as just a usual quip about a dad/husband wanting some freedom away from his mad/busy family rather than me personally just wanting to walk out. Although, I did at one point explain this to her, now that I think about it. She probably just thinks me mad. My wife is emotionally quite the opposite. Uber stable and never gets down. I envy her. Shes from a family that exists in a mind space that never drops below the emotionally unstable. She is never sad or unhappy, she can be angry, frustrated and disappointed but she never carries any negative emotional weight of her own. She is a bit of a rock or crutch it has to be said.

Are both of your teenagers difficult?

[Spuggy]

Originally Posted by Mr. Nobody

again,. I'm afraid I'm a poster who doesn't have children, but I did wonder about something,

what if you somehow see yourself as weak, due to SA,
you want your children to grow up to be strong and confident,
so, perhaps on some level you have created distance because of how you view yourself?
perhaps you subconsciously don't want your SA to influence their own behaviour, or for yourself to be seen as 'weak'?
so, you may have kept yourself on the fringes, imagining that this is some form of protection for them?

I think they would love to see your softer side,
some supposed weaknesses are actually strengths when viewed at a different level.

you will all be the richer for it if you can just be who you are around them.

I think there is some truth in this tbh. I keep them at bay so they cant be affected by it as if its something you can catch. I dont want them seeing a behaviour that they might pickup.

I guess as well, I keep them at bay so that I cant let them down. As you put above, so they cant see me being weak. Managing what they see of me allows me some control. Much like an instagram account where you only see the best of somebody. That is also definitely 'a thing' at play here too. As Ive always felt I am weak or simply 'shit' or not good enough, all of the above.

[Spuggy]

Originally Posted by Bored

"I just cant seem to make that adjustment." I suppose try and find out why you cant, have you tried therapy

I did have 20 sessions of CBT which helped massively and I was disappointed that it had to end. It was like I could feel it pulling me up from the depths.

It did help though. For a long while I didnt drop into the depths of depression and was able to keep my head above water. It did help me to manage my emotions better.

I would definitely recommend it.

[Spuggy]

Btw Thankyou all for replying. I cant tell you how much just chatting this through can lighten the mood.

Really appreciate you listening to me waffle on.

[That guy]

My son is my whole world.
You know, my son is the only person whom I can look into eyes continuously and enjoy it. He is also the only person who can look into my eyes continuously and don't express fear, hatred or disgust.
He is also the only person I have ever loved.

However, I think if I could turn time back I would choose not to have children.

I love my son so much and I am getting paranoid. Almost every day while I'm at work I keep on thinking that something bad might happen to him. Are these irrational thoughts I don't know, but I'm so scared, I am nervous, sweating and my heart racing while I am trying to focus on my work.
Most of my life I felt suicidal and in some ways I was looking for a right scenario for my death. With the birth of my son it changed and now not only I don't want to die, I am really afraid to die. Just keep on thinking how my little angel would be here without me.
Sometimes I think how great that would be if my son wouldn't love me.
Then I could distance from his. But now... he always greats me when I'm back from work and he likes to cuddle and sit there in my hands and he laughs with me.

[Aelwyn]

Spuggy - I agree with Nanuq you sound like a lovely dad - you're probably much better than you think.

Working alone like that is probably part of the problem. I know I would have jumped at the chance to work from home, because of pressures at work. But unfortunately it doesn't help with the SA. I suppose ideally you would balance the solitary part of your life with some other social activity. Would volunteering be an option for you?

That guy - it's great you've got that close relationship with your son. But the irrational thoughts must be taking away some of the happiness in that. Have you spoken to your GP, who could perhaps refer you for some counselling or therapy? I think it would be worth trying to get help, as parents' anxiety communicates itself to their children, and can make the children anxious too.