Job hunting woes of the older person

[Phool]

I was just wondering if there was anyone else looking for work and struggling at the moment? Or if you've found work how did you get there?

My situation is I'm 37 and took redundancy from the civil service in October. Since then I've applied for lots of jobs but seem to be getting nowhere not even to interview stage. I took some time out to travel but am seriously job hunting now and its all getting me down and I feel quite depressed now as if I will never get a new job.

My main issues are as follows:

"Over qualified" - Being a certain age I seem to be turned down for jobs that are lower grade or less pay than the one I had. I knew when I took redundancy I may have to take a lower paid job and am fine with it but I think employers look at m my CV and think "she won't stay, she'll move on" and I'm not sure how to counteract this.

Language - I somehow think the language you use in CVs and applications has changed. Quite often in addition to the job description and job specification employers seem to list a series of behaviours they expect you to demonstrate. I find this very hard to do, I try but I think I am doing something wrong here.

Online applications - I find these really difficult because quite often they time out and I have to start all over again. I now complete the personal statement bit in word and copy and paste back in. This seems to work better but sometimes the word count is too long or not enough, its not till you get to the section that you know what the word count will be. Grrr Any tips would be most welcome.

Skills set - I was what they call a generalist civil servant, doing research, policy or project management depending on the project but I am not an expert researcher or project manager so I find it hard to prove i can do jobs in these areas. Basically I'm a Jill of all trades and master of none and don't know what to do or how to pitch myself.

Retraining - I would like to move more into the culture and heritage sector, say museums or galleries or libraries but the masters is £9k and I'm not sure I would get a job if I retrained as there are so many people with experience in these areas looking for work.

Job centre plus - I've not had any help at all, or not meaningful help from jcp. They have a whole section for 18-24 year olds and seem to be talking to them all the time, helping with job searches etc. But they seem to expect me to just be able to get on with it even though the job hunting process has changed so much since I was last looking for work.

Blah, don't know what to do it's just getting me down, sorry for the rant but if anyone has advice I'd be grateful.

[Phool]

Originally Posted by AuroraSky

I am not even at a stage where I can begin job hunting yet and would likely need some voluntary experience to even become a credibile candidate. However for tuppence worth I would recommend the classic book, updated every year, "What Color Is Your Parachute?" by Richard Bolles. Everyone knows about it in the US and many people do here too so you may already be familiar with it but if not it's worth buying. Good luck it's not easy out there obviously but there are still some opportunities I hope.

Ooh I read it years ago when I finished my masters didn't realise they updated each year, I'll look into that. Thank you.

I did a bit of voluntary work and it is good for confidence building and I might do some more but since coming back I've wanted to focus on job hunting. Good luck with everything yourself, you always seem so positive am sure it will all work out when its meant to.

[Muse]

Unfortunately I have severe SA, so working is out of the question for me, so sorry, can't add anything of use.

[Phool]

Originally Posted by mark101

Besides the lack of jobs I'm at a loss with regards to explaining a 4 year gap in my employment and being unable to provide any references.

Could you do a bit of volunteering to get the references or do a course and get references from a tutor?

[Zardo]

I'm struggling to get work again as well, but I'm not that highly skilled and have really low confidence. The ongoing isolation and avoiding things due to feeling more anxious again isn't exactly helping either.

Anyway It's hard for everyone out there who have lost a job, even the highly skilled like you with experience. You've only been unemployed 5 months, I know you must feel disheartened but I'll be surprised if you're still jobless by the end of the year. Just have to keep motivated...somehow.

In regards to your CV, things have changed a little, wouldn't hurt to "jazz" it up or use a modern template. Not that doing that has helped me much! The behaviours and skills employers list for even mundane roles these days are ridiculous. I guess it's all about getting the most competent candidate [in theory] from the vast pool out there.

I don't mind on-line apps, prefer that to ringing up but they usually send an application form to fill in and return anyway. I have been avoiding ringing up places lately, can't bring myself to do it.

What are you best at? Why not say you are good at all of it, it's better to come across more fantastic than you actually are on the CV. Highlight the research and project management as a base.

As for not going for the masters because employers would choose someone else with experience anyway. Imagine if everyone going for a degree thought that, better to have it rather than nothing. Do what you want to do!

Jobcentre plus is a waste of time, they palmed me off to an external provider and they weren't much good either. Just like to make you feel worthless and stupid for not being able to get anyone to employ you. They concentrate on the 18 - 24s because of political pressure, it's unfair though yes. Most older people don't need the extra help though, but those that do are left on the scrapheap!

Good luck getting something soon anyway, I'm sure you'll be fine.

[Phool]

Thanks Zardo, glad its not just me about the whole behaviours thing, had to do them for a 2 month admin contract recently! and yeah jcp have been about as useful as a chocolate teapot. Keep plugging away, I'm sure something will turn up. But its good we have moral support on here.

[Phool]

Originally Posted by mark101

I tried to volunteer a year ago,filled in two application forms for a horse sanctuary near me. They were crying out for volunteers,so much so that they never called on me even after I phoned them to check they'd received my app forms. I'd gone out bought wellies and water proofs,so sure was I that I'd be given a chance to help out but hey ho,I've got no kennels in my town so there's not much to do.
I really can't do a college course because I'm just not academically minded,I can't even write in joined up. I've spent twenty years in construction but that's wrecked my back so I guess I have to go and stack shelves now.

Aw I'm sorry I don't know what to say to that.

[Phool]

Mark - no problem

Charlotte - I did get my CV looked at last year, it was a free service by a recruitment consultancy. I was thinking about paying someone and will look at your link, ,many thanks. I too have been toldthat there were hundreds and in some instances over a thousand applicants. its just tough out there. hope your son finds something he wants to do.

[dave81uk]

I'm really struggling with this at the moment, I can't even get anything local to apply for let alone worry about the interview, I've not applied for 1 job since January, there is simply bugger all out there at the moment, its really disheartening as all the info seems to be "Make job hunting your new job, set a schedule like you where at work etc" I can clear up job hunting in 10 mins, there is nothing to apply for. The last job I applied to was Tesco's stacking shelves at night, 800 people applied for 30 positions, its really done my head in as I've worked all my life, I am not used to doing nothing and being alone with my thoughts.

[951thompson]

Hiya phool,

I'm having a nightmare time of it too on the job search front. I think I'm in a similar situation to you, I am over qualified for some of the jobs I've been applying for (leaving the employers thinking he won't stay here long if we take him on) the jobs I am qualified for I have not got enough experience and they ain't alot of them around, so I'm left in limbo, its a nightmare. I can't find a job for trying : ( its poo!

Sending you lots of snowflakes

Andy

[951thompson]

Hiya phool,

I'm having a nightmare time of it too on the job search front. I think I'm in a similar situation to you, I am over qualified for some of the jobs I've been applying for (leaving the employers thinking he won't stay here long if we take him on) the jobs I am qualified for I have not got enough experience and they ain't alot of them around, so I'm left in limbo, its a nightmare. I can't find a job for trying : ( its poo!

Sending you lots of snowflakes

Andy

[Phool]

Originally Posted by dave81uk

I'm really struggling with this at the moment, I can't even get anything local to apply for let alone worry about the interview, I've not applied for 1 job since January, there is simply bugger all out there at the moment, its really disheartening as all the info seems to be "Make job hunting your new job, set a schedule like you where at work etc" I can clear up job hunting in 10 mins, there is nothing to apply for. The last job I applied to was Tesco's stacking shelves at night, 800 people applied for 30 positions, its really done my head in as I've worked all my life, I am not used to doing nothing and being alone with my thoughts.

Yeah i can relate. Hope you do see something you like.

Originally Posted by 951thompson

Hiya phool,

I'm having a nightmare time of it too on the job search front. I think I'm in a similar situation to you, I am over qualified for some of the jobs I've been applying for (leaving the employers thinking he won't stay here long if we take him on) the jobs I am qualified for I have not got enough experience and they ain't alot of them around, so I'm left in limbo, its a nightmare. I can't find a job for trying : ( its poo!

Sending you lots of snowflakes

Andy

Aw thanks for the snowflakes and hope you find something soon too.

I think the other thing is fear, i'm scared of applying for jobs like the one i was doing in case i can't handle the pressure and stress. :/

[951thompson]

Originally Posted by Phool

Yeah i can relate. Hope you do see something you like.



Aw thanks for the snowflakes and hope you find something soon too.

I think the other thing is fear, i'm scared of applying for jobs like the one i was doing in case i can't handle the pressure and stress. :/

Yeah that's something I worry about too. As I think I've told you before I had a stress induced mental brakedown brought on from my stressful job and then stressful home life, so with that in minf I would like to ease myself back into work gently. But the way things are I think its a case of having to take what you can get! I think me having a 4 year space on my CV from been unemployed due to been sick, puts employers off too. Its no good!Its really tough times, doesn't look like it will get better anytime soon too sadly.

Snowflakes!

[Vastaux]

Originally Posted by Phool

I was just wondering if there was anyone else looking for work and struggling at the moment? Or if you've found work how did you get there?

My situation is I'm 37 and took redundancy from the civil service in October. Since then I've applied for lots of jobs but seem to be getting nowhere not even to interview stage. I took some time out to travel but am seriously job hunting now and its all getting me down and I feel quite depressed now as if I will never get a new job.

My main issues are as follows:

"Over qualified" - Being a certain age I seem to be turned down for jobs that are lower grade or less pay than the one I had. I knew when I took redundancy I may have to take a lower paid job and am fine with it but I think employers look at m my CV and think "she won't stay, she'll move on" and I'm not sure how to counteract this.

Language - I somehow think the language you use in CVs and applications has changed. Quite often in addition to the job description and job specification employers seem to list a series of behaviours they expect you to demonstrate. I find this very hard to do, I try but I think I am doing something wrong here.

Online applications - I find these really difficult because quite often they time out and I have to start all over again. I now complete the personal statement bit in word and copy and paste back in. This seems to work better but sometimes the word count is too long or not enough, its not till you get to the section that you know what the word count will be. Grrr Any tips would be most welcome.

Skills set - I was what they call a generalist civil servant, doing research, policy or project management depending on the project but I am not an expert researcher or project manager so I find it hard to prove i can do jobs in these areas. Basically I'm a Jill of all trades and master of none and don't know what to do or how to pitch myself.

Retraining - I would like to move more into the culture and heritage sector, say museums or galleries or libraries but the masters is £9k and I'm not sure I would get a job if I retrained as there are so many people with experience in these areas looking for work.

Job centre plus - I've not had any help at all, or not meaningful help from jcp. They have a whole section for 18-24 year olds and seem to be talking to them all the time, helping with job searches etc. But they seem to expect me to just be able to get on with it even though the job hunting process has changed so much since I was last looking for work.

Blah, don't know what to do it's just getting me down, sorry for the rant but if anyone has advice I'd be grateful.

I was listening to LBC the other week and they were talking about this,tbh jobs comes up alot lately, but one guy who came on said he wouldnt mind doing anything, he was about 50 years old and for one reason or another (cant remember) had lost his "good job", even cleaning he would settle for, he just wanted to work, but they wouldnt have him because he was too qualified and had worked in hotels as management for so many years.

So what he said he does is have a couple of variations of the same C.V, one for good jobs on same qualification as he had used and another one which was tweaked or "dumbed down", so employers wouldnt turn him away for being too qualified...

Just thought i'd make the point, obviously i know you have other factors but that is potentially one way round that issue.

[Somebody]

I'm sure something will turn up Phooly, just have to keep believing Fall five times, stand up six.

[Phool]

Thanks for the replies everyone. I appreciate everyone is finding it hard at the moment with the market the way it is. And sorry to those that have been unemployed long term, I don't know what to say on tha other than it must be very daunting. i know i am dreading interviews if i ever get one.

I guess i've worked most of my life so am a bit scared and feel quite insecure at the moment and I'm also worried I'm getting depressed staying at home. i don't really go out unless i have to, i've been out twice in the past two weeks. :/

I shall keep trying and good luck to everyone who is looking.

[dave81uk]

Originally Posted by Phool

Thanks for the replies everyone. I appreciate everyone is finding it hard at the moment with the market the way it is. And sorry to those that have been unemployed long term, I don't know what to say on tha other than it must be very daunting. i know i am dreading interviews if i ever get one.

I guess i've worked most of my life so am a bit scared and feel quite insecure at the moment and I'm also worried I'm getting depressed staying at home. i don't really go out unless i have to, i've been out twice in the past two weeks. :/

I shall keep trying and good luck to everyone who is looking.

I am not getting interviews either which isn't surprising as I am not applying for anything because there is nothing to apply for, its a joke. Last interview I had was January.

[dave81uk]

Originally Posted by Lone Dog

I never got a job by applying for something that was advertised. My jobs came through people I knew, and also from just sending letters & CVs to companies whose addresses I got from the yellow pages. Maybe try this, Dave.

These days, of course, the internet is the thing. Has anyone had any luck via this route? Anyone uploaded their CV and had success?

Yes knowing people seems to be the main route people get jobs these days, All my former colleagues got jobs this way. With my SA I have no friend or acquittance's, So I think send out CV's has to be the way forward. Out of interest I read this week for every position advertised on average 6 unemployed people apply, thats not counting the amount of people employed who apply for it, and 9 times out of 10 the job goes to someone already employed, its tough.

[Phool]

Originally Posted by dave81uk

Yes knowing people seems to be the main route people get jobs these days, All my former colleagues got jobs this way. With my SA I have no friend or acquittance's, So I think send out CV's has to be the way forward. Out of interest I read this week for every position advertised on average 6 unemployed people apply, thats not counting the amount of people employed who apply for it, and 9 times out of 10 the job goes to someone already employed, its tough.

I've applied for jobs and been told there were over 1000 applicants. Most in London attract hundreds of applications.

[Vastaux]

When i was involved in recruiting at a Tesco express we had about 80 applications for just a simple customer assistant job in like the first few days, this was about 2 years ago now, but it doesnt surprise me as the situation has only got worse imo.

[Hackpen]

Ive just started a return to work group, specifically for people with mental health problems. I almost bottled out but im glad i went. It was kind of in at the deep end cos groups of people in close proximity is sa hell for me. I surprised myself with the amount of talking i did, i was anxious of course but i ploughed on. Its a good environment to push my boundaries as it doesnt matter if i f*ck up, although its still uncomfortable! As well as helping with employment skills and job hunting they can also provide placements with employers that employ you for a probationary period to see if you can cut it. Highly recommended if you have something similar in your area.
All the best with your job hunting everyone

[Phool]

Originally Posted by Hackpen

Ive just started a return to work group, specifically for people with mental health problems. I almost bottled out but im glad i went. It was kind of in at the deep end cos groups of people in close proximity is sa hell for me. I surprised myself with the amount of talking i did, i was anxious of course but i ploughed on. Its a good environment to push my boundaries as it doesnt matter if i f*ck up, although its still uncomfortable! As well as helping with employment skills and job hunting they can also provide placements with employers that employ you for a probationary period to see if you can cut it. Highly recommended if you have something similar in your area.
All the best with your job hunting everyone

This sounds great, well done for going. I'm going to see if there is something like that in our area.

[catlover]

Phool, I"m sorry to hear of your difficulties finding employment.

I currently have a job, but the stress is making me literally sick: unable to sleep, tightness in chest, general anxiety. I'm trying to find something less stressful (lower pay would not be a problem), but I'm coming up blank.

I'm in programming, which is a highly specialized field; there is no such thing as a "generalist programmer". If you don't have the desired specialized experience, they won't consider you. I wouldn't mind moving to another (less stressful) field, but you can't readily do that, as every job wants experience in the relevant field.

In addition, my interviewing skills are really poor, and I have great difficulty fitting in with new people. In my field, you have to be willing to ask a lot of questions in order to get started at a new job, and I find that difficult.

And, finally, I find the concept of "selling yourself", which is apparently what you're expected to do these days on your applications/CVs/resumes, to be disgusting and contrary to my personal value system.

So the upshot is that I'm "stuck" in a job that I hate and that's making me sick!!



Just a thought: have you considered library science -- working as a reference librarian in a university or government library, perhaps in the fields you're familiar with, such as economics and/or statistics?

[Phool]

Originally Posted by catlover

And, finally, I find the concept of "selling yourself", which is apparently what you're expected to do these days on your applications/CVs/resumes, to be disgusting and contrary to my personal value system.

So the upshot is that I'm "stuck" in a job that I hate and that's making me sick!!

Just a tought: have you considered library science -- working as a reference librarian in a university or government library, perhaps in the fields you're familiar with, such as economics and/or statistics?

Hi catlover

Thanks for the post, I also find the whole "selling yourself" bit quite difficult. I do look at the library jobs, but they all seem to want experience and usually a librarianship qualification. I might look into doing a course if I'm still unemployed in September when the new term starts.

Sorry your job is making you ill, I know what that is like, part of the reason I took redundancy.

[catlover]

I don't think a five year gap is necessarily unattractive, as long as you have a coherent explanation that won't make the interviewer think that you won't be able to perform the job to which you're applying.

You mentioned back problems arising from your years in the construction industry; I imagine you wouldn't want any job involving heavy lifting, but would you be able to do a job that involved continuous sitting (e.g., truck driver or office job) or continuous standing (e.g., retail)?

Alternatively, is there a possibility of a supervisory or consulting position in construction that would allow you to build on your experience but not stress your back?

[desi99]

Originally Posted by mark101

This isn't age related but i wonder how attractive it is that i have a nearly five year gap in my employment record

Fill the gap by any means otherwise you are not getting a job again. I deal a lot with recruitment agents so I know.
Make up something like , you had an accident, caring for an elederly relative, travelling abroad, doing online courses, family situations ,volunteering etc
Dont worry about reference , give a friends' number.

[desi99]

Hi Phool
First of all, revamp your CV , there are dozens of free and paid website which help you make an excellent CV. After that just start applying left right and centre. In the last 6 months I sent my CV to hundreds of agents and finally managed to land up a position.
its all a game of luck. If possible, volunteer in your chosen field.
Keep in contact with your colleagues from old jobs and keep asking them for any vacancies. Networking helps.

[Phool]

Originally Posted by desi99

Hi Phool
First of all, revamp your CV , there are dozens of free and paid website which help you make an excellent CV. After that just start applying left right and centre. In the last 6 months I sent my CV to hundreds of agents and finally managed to land up a position.
its all a game of luck. If possible, volunteer in your chosen field.
Keep in contact with your colleagues from old jobs and keep asking them for any vacancies. Networking helps.

Thanks, i have reworked my CV lots since I posted this, I have about 4 versions. I do apply for lots of jobs, some that I wouldn't have looked at a year ago, just because I want to get back to work. I do keep in touch with former colleagues, but I worked for a government department and they are still culling staff through redundancies so there are no jobs in there.

Agents are starting to take an interest now and helping with the tailoring of CVs for specific posts, so we shall see what happens.

Congratulations on finding your job.

[mhealer3]

i'm in that same situation.
after being injured @ my job of 15 years, im not supposed 2 lift anymore.

also my SA has prevented me from taking a job @ fast-food places (like mcdonalds).
hungry people scare me...lol.

[far north]

Originally Posted by Charlotte87

Or a person could always be honest and say they have been unable to work for so long, due to having mental health problems? Companies are supposedly not allowed to discriminate.

Supposedly perhaps , but it reality they usually do.